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[Music]

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you're in the paracast

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the gold standard of paranormal radio

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and now

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with gene and chris

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a little bit later in this episode we'll

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be returning to the abduction phenomenon

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this time taking what i call a middle of

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the road approach

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the subject it's been very contentious

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of course when we had dr david jacobs on

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the power cast a few weeks ago

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boy that really stirred up a hornet's

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nest so later today we'll be talking to

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kathleen martin

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she's a niece of betty hill

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she investigates abductions with mufon

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and she's a hypnotherapist

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so she is qualified to administer

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hypnosis which unfortunately is not true

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about others

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now

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from time to time here on the power cast

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and this is nothing new if you've read

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the writings of john keel you've heard

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this stuff about this reflective factor

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in ufos in the ufo field paranormal

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field kind of attracting

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events your way like

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to run

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is an invitation to be chased

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and we were talking about in connection

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with ufo research the fact that some

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researchers

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will have a theory and then just

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strangely

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receive the evidence that inevitably

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confirms that theory

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as if the phenomenon whatever it is is

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taking an active

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approach to verify their beliefs have

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you ever encountered that in your own

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work chris well you know i have but i

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admonish witnesses and when people ask

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for

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you know sky watching tips do's and

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don'ts i always remind them

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that

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the phenomenon

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or phenomena depending on the case

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obviously uh has a tendency to

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to reflect the kind of emotional state

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that the witness or witnesses are in

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and oftentimes if if people act out of a

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place of fear they're given something to

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be afraid of if they act

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out of a place of

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giddiness and wonder

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somehow the phenomenon supplies

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something to even increase that uh

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elation

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uh oftentimes if you rush towards an

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object it'll rush towards you if you

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pull away and start to go go back it'll

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pull away and go back it'll mirror color

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changes

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so there does tend to be almost like a

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mirror like reflective quality

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and uh i think it's

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it's important for people when they go

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out in the field to maintain

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a very steady

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low-key

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uh non-emotional non

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try to keep us as even keeled as

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possible while out in the field number

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one you're able to remember to do things

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like grab cameras uh focus properly make

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sure it's in record that sort of thing

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and it also uh tends to create more of a

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neutral i think

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feedback feedback loop where you're not

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dealing with over-the-top elements that

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tend to make it more difficult to

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document a particular case or sighting

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so

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haunted site investigation

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boy if you're if you're in a place of

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fear

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somehow the if there's something going

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on you you will be given stimuli to

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increase your fear i can tell you from

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personal experience that that has

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happened to me once

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give an example

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of this

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reaction to fear

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well i was in the basement filming a

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psychic actually a very good one

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amy allen and uh the two former

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uh tenants of the sally house and i had

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my back to what whatever was coming

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up through the floor there was some very

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cold dark powerful energy that i've

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distinctly felt

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and i felt it before anybody mentioned

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it

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because i was holding a camera shot on

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the faces of the three in front of me

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i'll tell you i never felt a feeling

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like this before it was like a cold hand

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reached in my back

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and very slowly started to squeeze my

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heart

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and if amy hadn't said we need to get

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out of here right right this second if

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she hadn't said it right right at that

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split second i would have i would have

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dashed out of there

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so that that gives you an idea in the

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the more i fell into fear the harder the

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squeezing god so

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i'm not sure if that's a very good

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example it's the only one i can give you

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um that um

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where i actually know for a fact that i

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started to react

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from a deep place of fear

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that's really unlike me it's one of the

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maybe one or two times that i've ever

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ever actually been in a place of fear

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out in the field i tend to be very

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you know

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circumspect

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you basically have to be cool

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yeah if because if you're not you're

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going to attract things

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now once you get into that state of mind

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though

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there's no way to come out of it you

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can't just meditate your way out of it

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or will yourself you just basically have

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to get out of there but then again that

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may be attracting further problems

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well well you can if it's if it's a

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purely emotional or psychological

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response that you're you're finding

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yourself uh

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enacting

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when it's a physical sensation like i

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described it's

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it's virtually impossible to

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to not um

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by you know be affected by they were

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impacted by the by the physical

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sensation of

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whatever it might be

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so

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you know if it's just a purely emotional

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response that you're having or some sort

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reaction uh

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to some sort of stimuli if you if you're

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reacting internally emotionally uh it's

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easier to keep keep an even keel with it

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as opposed to some sort of physical

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sensation

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well i know i haven't been put into too

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many situations where i had any fear i

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think the only time i ever felt anything

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totally irrational

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was actually back

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in the 60s late 60s when my first wife

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geneva and i

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just a few weeks after we got our first

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new car

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we started motoring around

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just to see what was going on

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and then

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we rode towards a

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small two-lane road

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which i used to get to the radio station

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which i worked

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and at some point this is really dark

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they didn't have street lights or

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anything

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we suddenly felt a wave of fear or at

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least i did and i said you know what i

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have to get out of here

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so i found a convenient way

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to make a u-turn and i did

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and that was it it happened once

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now i don't know if i had stayed there

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what might have happened maybe nothing

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maybe it was all my imagination

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maybe it was due to the fact that i was

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not an experienced driver and certainly

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not experienced driving at night

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but it was really weird when it happened

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there been some sort of psychosomatic or

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psychological

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you know fear willing up welling up

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inside you

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possibly possibly

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yeah you had no external stimuli to put

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you in that in that place

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that are not that i am consciously aware

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of

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no

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well

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the now let me give you a location here

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this is a small town in alabama

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tuscumbia

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which is part of these quad cities

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in the northwest part of the state near

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muscle shoals of course we all know

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muscle trolls it's a home of the famous

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the famous muscle shoals

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sound studios

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where at the time we lived there they

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were doing sessions with percy sledge

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and a aretha franklin that's a whole

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other story

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really

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and i was too dumb to know about all

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this

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wow that's going back a ways there dude

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it's going back a ways late 60s

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when a man loves a woman

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uh we have to pay a copyright fee now

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for what chris just did he's going to

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write out a check

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well i'm glad that you didn't quit your

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day job

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but you know chris is obviously a

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professional musician he's just goofing

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on us right off yes of course okay well

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rick hall and um

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i think fame fame studios yes

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because there were two studios all is is

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muscle shoals sound studios fame studios

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and it's complicated to explain what is

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what the point being here some of the

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greatest

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music

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of all time was recorded there

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even paul mccartney later on years later

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recorded there the rolling stones

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recorded there brown sugar you're right

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amazing place

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but we don't have time for that because

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this is the power cast

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our guest is kathleen martin

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she heads up abduction investigations

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for

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the mutual ufo network where she was

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named the 2012 ufologist of the year

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she's been at this game for 25 years

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let's find out what she's learned

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let's do a little myth busting

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and of course she'll answer your

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questions with gene and chris you're in

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[Music]

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so here's what happened i was placing an

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order online the site went down it took

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hours before it returned but i'd already

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placed the order with another company if

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your site goes down you could lose

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business and if you have a business or

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personal site you'll want to know it's

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easy to run and it will stay online at

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iweb your site is hosted on one of the

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most reliable networks in the world talk

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to a sales rep at iweb.com use the promo

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code tech night owl for a special

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discount first game attack of the

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rockoids and it was a critically

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acclaimed success and now there is the

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coming of the protectors a former

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military intelligence man is contacted

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by a space woman in a dream a dream that

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turns out to be a nightmare because evil

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forces on her distant planet are

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planning to conquer the earth this is

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gripping science fiction of the classic

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kind attack of the rockoids and the

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coming of the protectors find out more

287
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at rockoaids.com that's rockoids

288
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r-o-c-k-o-i-d-s dot com

289
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you're fired according to the small

290
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business administration 75 percent of

291
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small businesses plan to eliminate jobs

292
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or reduce workers hours to part time

293
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you're fired according to gallup the

294
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unemployment rate recently jumped to

295
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nearly nine percent and the

296
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underemployment rate hit a staggering

297
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17.9 percent you're fired one out of

298
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three young adults and one out of two

299
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recent college graduates are

300
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underemployed hello i'm keith abel a

301
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pharmacist and a home business

302
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entrepreneur in 2011 i became one of

303
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those statistics myself instead of

304
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looking for another job in corporate

305
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america i joined dr joel waller the dead

306
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doctors don't lie guy we're creating

307
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steady incomes for ourselves and would

308
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like to show you how to do the same if

309
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you want to supplement your current

310
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income replace your income so you don't

311
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have to become one of the statistics

312
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then give me a call toll free at

313
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you're fired don't wait till you hear

314
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those words start creating an extra

315
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371
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hospitalization and even death phone

372
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lines are open 24 7. call

373
00:14:05,750 --> 00:14:03,269
we'd like to hear from you if you have a

374
00:14:09,350 --> 00:14:05,760
comment or question about the paracast

375
00:14:12,550 --> 00:14:09,360
send it to news theparacast.com

376
00:14:14,389 --> 00:14:12,560
that's news at theparacast.com

377
00:14:16,870 --> 00:14:14,399
and don't forget to visit our famous

378
00:14:21,189 --> 00:14:16,880
paracast community forums at

379
00:14:24,870 --> 00:14:23,110
we have kathleen martin joining us on

380
00:14:25,829 --> 00:14:24,880
the power cast today but before we get

381
00:14:27,030 --> 00:14:25,839
to her

382
00:14:28,870 --> 00:14:27,040
before we

383
00:14:30,389 --> 00:14:28,880
ask lots of questions including the ones

384
00:14:32,470 --> 00:14:30,399
you've posted listeners

385
00:14:35,110 --> 00:14:32,480
let me remind you that we have a second

386
00:14:36,870 --> 00:14:35,120
radio show we'd love you to listen to

387
00:14:38,949 --> 00:14:36,880
it's called after the powercast and

388
00:14:40,069 --> 00:14:38,959
there's an easy way to do it you sign up

389
00:14:42,829 --> 00:14:40,079
and join

390
00:14:45,590 --> 00:14:42,839
the powercast plus go to

391
00:14:48,230 --> 00:14:45,600
plus.powercast.com to learn more we give

392
00:14:50,069 --> 00:14:48,240
you the ad free version of this show and

393
00:14:52,629 --> 00:14:50,079
people complain about the ads but

394
00:14:54,230 --> 00:14:52,639
remember networks make money from ads so

395
00:14:57,110 --> 00:14:54,240
that's how the system works but if you

396
00:14:59,590 --> 00:14:57,120
don't want them we charge you a modest

397
00:15:01,910 --> 00:14:59,600
subscription fee to get rid of them we

398
00:15:04,389 --> 00:15:01,920
offer additional incentives to join the

399
00:15:07,750 --> 00:15:04,399
powercast plus like after the powercast

400
00:15:09,590 --> 00:15:07,760
we've begun to add show transcripts and

401
00:15:11,750 --> 00:15:09,600
the videos coming chris right the

402
00:15:14,150 --> 00:15:11,760
video's coming right as a matter of fact

403
00:15:16,230 --> 00:15:14,160
i've been working on it uh this weekend

404
00:15:17,509 --> 00:15:16,240
i'm going to be working on it uh this

405
00:15:19,829 --> 00:15:17,519
past weekend rather i'm going to be

406
00:15:21,189 --> 00:15:19,839
working on it today after the show and

407
00:15:23,870 --> 00:15:21,199
hopefully by the time the show comes out

408
00:15:27,590 --> 00:15:23,880
we'll have at least a teaser clip go to

409
00:15:28,389 --> 00:15:27,600
plus.powercast.com plus.

410
00:15:31,350 --> 00:15:28,399
now

411
00:15:34,870 --> 00:15:31,360
kathleen martin has been at

412
00:15:36,629 --> 00:15:34,880
the ufo investigative game for 25 years

413
00:15:37,750 --> 00:15:36,639
and she's written three books that we've

414
00:15:39,910 --> 00:15:37,760
talked about

415
00:15:41,110 --> 00:15:39,920
captured the betty and barney hill ufo

416
00:15:43,030 --> 00:15:41,120
experience

417
00:15:44,550 --> 00:15:43,040
science was wrong with our friend

418
00:15:46,790 --> 00:15:44,560
stanton friedman

419
00:15:49,430 --> 00:15:46,800
and the alien abduction files with

420
00:15:52,230 --> 00:15:49,440
denise stoner who of course

421
00:15:54,150 --> 00:15:52,240
is an abductee very fascinating kathleen

422
00:15:56,389 --> 00:15:54,160
welcome back to the power powercast

423
00:15:57,910 --> 00:15:56,399
thank you great to be with you again

424
00:16:00,550 --> 00:15:57,920
i'm looking at this picture of you back

425
00:16:02,790 --> 00:16:00,560
in 2012 it's like a little oscar from a

426
00:16:06,310 --> 00:16:02,800
distance doesn't it look like that

427
00:16:09,350 --> 00:16:06,320
yes it does the mutual ufo network

428
00:16:12,790 --> 00:16:09,360
awarded me the researcher of the year

429
00:16:14,069 --> 00:16:12,800
award for my work for mufon

430
00:16:16,949 --> 00:16:14,079
well chris we're going to give the

431
00:16:19,030 --> 00:16:16,959
trickster of the year award

432
00:16:21,509 --> 00:16:19,040
right chris seriously we should do that

433
00:16:22,870 --> 00:16:21,519
sounds like the trickies i like it hey

434
00:16:24,150 --> 00:16:22,880
we can yes we can develop something

435
00:16:26,870 --> 00:16:24,160
called the trickies we'll have to have

436
00:16:29,269 --> 00:16:26,880
the artwork done and each year here at

437
00:16:32,710 --> 00:16:29,279
the paracast we'll give away a tricky

438
00:16:34,310 --> 00:16:32,720
right we can have it 3d printed

439
00:16:36,230 --> 00:16:34,320
hey this sounds like fun yeah one of

440
00:16:38,069 --> 00:16:36,240
these big 3d printers you can churn out

441
00:16:40,310 --> 00:16:38,079
these things real fast

442
00:16:41,910 --> 00:16:40,320
you know the trickies i like that

443
00:16:43,430 --> 00:16:41,920
good idea gene

444
00:16:45,110 --> 00:16:43,440
well i'll tell you what i'll patent that

445
00:16:48,310 --> 00:16:45,120
idea the tricky

446
00:16:51,910 --> 00:16:48,320
every year from the power cast kathleen

447
00:16:55,030 --> 00:16:51,920
as you know the abduction research field

448
00:16:56,389 --> 00:16:55,040
is very very polarizing

449
00:16:58,870 --> 00:16:56,399
back in

450
00:17:00,790 --> 00:16:58,880
mid-october we had dr david jacobs on

451
00:17:03,509 --> 00:17:00,800
here and we've had him on the power cast

452
00:17:05,510 --> 00:17:03,519
before and there are controversies there

453
00:17:08,150 --> 00:17:05,520
but this time

454
00:17:11,429 --> 00:17:08,160
everything went over the rails

455
00:17:13,829 --> 00:17:11,439
people love him people hate him people

456
00:17:16,870 --> 00:17:13,839
think he's a devil incarnate a lot of

457
00:17:19,350 --> 00:17:16,880
that due to this controversy over this

458
00:17:21,189 --> 00:17:19,360
test subject of his from new zealand

459
00:17:22,390 --> 00:17:21,199
who has spent i guess the last eight

460
00:17:24,150 --> 00:17:22,400
years

461
00:17:26,150 --> 00:17:24,160
trying to bring him down

462
00:17:27,829 --> 00:17:26,160
you know i don't know what to say about

463
00:17:30,470 --> 00:17:27,839
it except i try to take a middle of the

464
00:17:32,390 --> 00:17:30,480
road approach that we need to look at

465
00:17:34,310 --> 00:17:32,400
all different theories and give them

466
00:17:36,070 --> 00:17:34,320
their due to find out what's going on

467
00:17:37,590 --> 00:17:36,080
once you know what happens gene when you

468
00:17:39,510 --> 00:17:37,600
do that

469
00:17:43,350 --> 00:17:39,520
yes you set yourself up as a target for

470
00:17:47,190 --> 00:17:43,360
both ends of the uh of the equation

471
00:17:48,390 --> 00:17:47,200
so this way instead of trying to do this

472
00:17:52,230 --> 00:17:48,400
calmly

473
00:17:55,510 --> 00:17:53,430
kathleen

474
00:17:57,830 --> 00:17:55,520
you must have encountered some of this

475
00:18:01,029 --> 00:17:57,840
going forward in your research

476
00:18:02,150 --> 00:18:01,039
how do you deal with it well i have to

477
00:18:03,669 --> 00:18:02,160
say that

478
00:18:05,029 --> 00:18:03,679
i don't know

479
00:18:07,350 --> 00:18:05,039
the answers

480
00:18:08,870 --> 00:18:07,360
i don't think anybody does some people

481
00:18:10,390 --> 00:18:08,880
think they do

482
00:18:11,669 --> 00:18:10,400
but

483
00:18:15,669 --> 00:18:11,679
i am

484
00:18:18,630 --> 00:18:15,679
a scholar a student of all of this

485
00:18:19,909 --> 00:18:18,640
and i do the best i can to try to make

486
00:18:23,190 --> 00:18:19,919
sense of it

487
00:18:26,390 --> 00:18:23,200
i realize that people are very polarized

488
00:18:29,990 --> 00:18:26,400
in their views there are many people who

489
00:18:31,830 --> 00:18:30,000
have this black and white all-or-nothing

490
00:18:35,350 --> 00:18:31,840
uh mentality

491
00:18:38,870 --> 00:18:35,360
and i just don't have that i see

492
00:18:40,789 --> 00:18:38,880
the shades of gray in all of this and

493
00:18:44,070 --> 00:18:40,799
i'm not going to

494
00:18:44,950 --> 00:18:44,080
jump off the fence to one side or the

495
00:18:48,390 --> 00:18:44,960
other

496
00:18:49,830 --> 00:18:48,400
until i have more answers than i have

497
00:18:50,789 --> 00:18:49,840
right now

498
00:18:52,870 --> 00:18:50,799
and

499
00:18:54,830 --> 00:18:52,880
you know we're in a very very difficult

500
00:18:58,710 --> 00:18:54,840
situation

501
00:18:59,669 --> 00:18:58,720
because many many experiencers

502
00:19:01,430 --> 00:18:59,679
uh

503
00:19:04,710 --> 00:19:01,440
are traumatized

504
00:19:07,669 --> 00:19:04,720
by what they've experienced they

505
00:19:09,830 --> 00:19:07,679
they find that this is very negative

506
00:19:11,669 --> 00:19:09,840
they're frightened they're taken against

507
00:19:15,029 --> 00:19:11,679
their will

508
00:19:17,990 --> 00:19:15,039
there's no consent given

509
00:19:19,270 --> 00:19:18,000
there's no way to stop this from

510
00:19:21,750 --> 00:19:19,280
occurring

511
00:19:23,990 --> 00:19:21,760
having your implant removed is not going

512
00:19:30,789 --> 00:19:24,000
to stop it

513
00:19:33,510 --> 00:19:30,799
there's really nothing you can do you're

514
00:19:36,390 --> 00:19:33,520
you're sort of a helpless victim

515
00:19:40,549 --> 00:19:36,400
on that end of the spectrum you're being

516
00:19:42,870 --> 00:19:40,559
used and abused you're a laboratory rat

517
00:19:46,230 --> 00:19:42,880
and there's nothing you can do

518
00:19:49,029 --> 00:19:46,240
on the other end of the spectrum

519
00:19:51,750 --> 00:19:49,039
you have the individuals who

520
00:19:54,310 --> 00:19:51,760
believe that this is all an agreement

521
00:19:55,430 --> 00:19:54,320
that they made at a soul

522
00:19:57,590 --> 00:19:55,440
level

523
00:20:01,190 --> 00:19:57,600
that they volunteered

524
00:20:02,230 --> 00:20:01,200
to be part of this experiment

525
00:20:04,950 --> 00:20:02,240
with

526
00:20:07,990 --> 00:20:04,960
greys and and others

527
00:20:09,590 --> 00:20:08,000
who are coming here to learn more about

528
00:20:12,310 --> 00:20:09,600
earthlings

529
00:20:15,590 --> 00:20:12,320
and to help to improve

530
00:20:18,470 --> 00:20:15,600
life on this planet they talk about the

531
00:20:22,870 --> 00:20:18,480
ascension they talk about the wonderful

532
00:20:25,029 --> 00:20:22,880
future of the earth with the aliens help

533
00:20:28,070 --> 00:20:25,039
in between that

534
00:20:30,630 --> 00:20:28,080
we have a broad spectrum

535
00:20:34,230 --> 00:20:30,640
of individuals who

536
00:20:37,110 --> 00:20:34,240
are a little bit confused who don't know

537
00:20:40,470 --> 00:20:37,120
all of the answers who can see both

538
00:20:42,149 --> 00:20:40,480
sides of the story who can see the

539
00:20:43,190 --> 00:20:42,159
emotionality

540
00:20:45,510 --> 00:20:43,200
about

541
00:20:49,029 --> 00:20:45,520
all of this and realize

542
00:20:52,390 --> 00:20:49,039
that human emotion plays a very large

543
00:20:55,029 --> 00:20:52,400
part in our perception of the events

544
00:20:57,669 --> 00:20:55,039
that occur in our lives

545
00:20:59,909 --> 00:20:57,679
uh you know so it it's it's very very

546
00:21:02,630 --> 00:20:59,919
difficult to be part of all of this and

547
00:21:07,590 --> 00:21:02,640
i have been criticized for being on the

548
00:21:10,470 --> 00:21:07,600
fence uh before and you know so be it

549
00:21:11,830 --> 00:21:10,480
i am not going to jump to one side or

550
00:21:13,669 --> 00:21:11,840
the other

551
00:21:16,070 --> 00:21:13,679
just because somebody doesn't like the

552
00:21:17,350 --> 00:21:16,080
fact that i haven't made up my mind

553
00:21:19,350 --> 00:21:17,360
entirely

554
00:21:21,110 --> 00:21:19,360
okay let's focus on a couple of the

555
00:21:24,230 --> 00:21:21,120
different viewpoints here let me know

556
00:21:25,990 --> 00:21:24,240
what you think so dr david jacobs

557
00:21:27,430 --> 00:21:26,000
i guess to some degree the late bud

558
00:21:29,190 --> 00:21:27,440
hopkins follow

559
00:21:31,990 --> 00:21:29,200
his point of view here

560
00:21:34,390 --> 00:21:32,000
is that the aliens are here to create a

561
00:21:36,870 --> 00:21:34,400
hybrid race

562
00:21:39,590 --> 00:21:36,880
and part of that agenda according to dr

563
00:21:41,909 --> 00:21:39,600
jacobs may be to take us over

564
00:21:43,750 --> 00:21:41,919
so this is a pretty horrendous thing

565
00:21:45,990 --> 00:21:43,760
now we have about 50 seconds before we

566
00:21:48,390 --> 00:21:46,000
have to break so i'm going to ask you

567
00:21:50,470 --> 00:21:48,400
very quickly to give me a reaction then

568
00:21:52,149 --> 00:21:50,480
we'll flesh it out in our next segment

569
00:21:54,149 --> 00:21:52,159
so what do you think do you think that

570
00:21:55,350 --> 00:21:54,159
e.t is here to make a race of hybrid

571
00:21:57,270 --> 00:21:55,360
aliens to

572
00:21:59,110 --> 00:21:57,280
to assume control

573
00:22:02,950 --> 00:21:59,120
my goodness well

574
00:22:05,110 --> 00:22:02,960
regardless of what side of the spectrum

575
00:22:06,950 --> 00:22:05,120
you look at

576
00:22:09,909 --> 00:22:06,960
both are saying

577
00:22:13,029 --> 00:22:09,919
that the aliens to some extent are

578
00:22:15,350 --> 00:22:13,039
creating a new kind of human

579
00:22:22,789 --> 00:22:15,360
a type of human

580
00:22:24,149 --> 00:22:22,799
that is more caring and less violent

581
00:22:25,750 --> 00:22:24,159
a type of

582
00:22:27,270 --> 00:22:25,760
human that

583
00:22:31,029 --> 00:22:27,280
can feel

584
00:22:34,630 --> 00:22:31,039
the emotions of other people and the

585
00:22:36,390 --> 00:22:34,640
impact that they have upon other people

586
00:22:39,909 --> 00:22:36,400
let's go more into that in our next

587
00:22:50,230 --> 00:22:39,919
segment with kathleen martin and gene

588
00:22:54,990 --> 00:22:53,669
thank you for listening to gcn

589
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[Music]

689
00:27:06,710 --> 00:27:03,830
hi this is don ecker and you are tuned

690
00:27:09,110 --> 00:27:06,720
in to the paracast let me tell you what

691
00:27:12,470 --> 00:27:09,120
you're going to hear stuff here that you

692
00:27:14,870 --> 00:27:12,480
probably won't hear anywhere else hear

693
00:27:16,549 --> 00:27:14,880
that george snoring

694
00:27:18,710 --> 00:27:16,559
chris of course is adding his best

695
00:27:20,630 --> 00:27:18,720
hybrid voice there

696
00:27:22,710 --> 00:27:20,640
it's a hybrid of i don't know what

697
00:27:23,909 --> 00:27:22,720
kathleen martin joining us we're talking

698
00:27:26,149 --> 00:27:23,919
about

699
00:27:27,269 --> 00:27:26,159
the different approaches to abduction

700
00:27:28,149 --> 00:27:27,279
research

701
00:27:29,750 --> 00:27:28,159
now

702
00:27:31,669 --> 00:27:29,760
let's just for the sake of argument

703
00:27:32,710 --> 00:27:31,679
assume that we have an extraterrestrial

704
00:27:35,110 --> 00:27:32,720
race

705
00:27:37,990 --> 00:27:35,120
creating an idealized

706
00:27:40,070 --> 00:27:38,000
hybrid race human alien

707
00:27:41,909 --> 00:27:40,080
with all the bad things we do

708
00:27:44,870 --> 00:27:41,919
the tribal wars

709
00:27:48,070 --> 00:27:44,880
all the nasty stuff we do

710
00:27:49,590 --> 00:27:48,080
white collar crime whatever it is kind

711
00:27:53,350 --> 00:27:49,600
of

712
00:27:55,510 --> 00:27:53,360
now

713
00:27:57,750 --> 00:27:55,520
what's the purpose and end game here if

714
00:28:02,070 --> 00:27:57,760
they're creating this halo of a race

715
00:28:04,149 --> 00:28:02,080
here this wonderful peace loving people

716
00:28:06,870 --> 00:28:04,159
are they going to replace us or just

717
00:28:08,710 --> 00:28:06,880
infiltrate our society what

718
00:28:11,190 --> 00:28:08,720
it depends upon

719
00:28:13,269 --> 00:28:11,200
whose opinion you listen to of course in

720
00:28:14,870 --> 00:28:13,279
terms of my opinion

721
00:28:18,710 --> 00:28:14,880
on that

722
00:28:23,029 --> 00:28:18,720
received from

723
00:28:25,669 --> 00:28:23,039
what i believe are credible individuals

724
00:28:29,190 --> 00:28:25,679
they do not state that they are

725
00:28:33,110 --> 00:28:29,200
attempting to take over

726
00:28:34,389 --> 00:28:33,120
life on earth or to change us

727
00:28:38,310 --> 00:28:34,399
in

728
00:28:41,350 --> 00:28:38,320
large way

729
00:28:43,110 --> 00:28:41,360
i certainly would never want to live

730
00:28:45,990 --> 00:28:43,120
in a society

731
00:28:48,470 --> 00:28:46,000
that had a hive mentality the way they

732
00:28:50,310 --> 00:28:48,480
do i don't think that any of us would

733
00:28:52,470 --> 00:28:50,320
want to do that

734
00:28:54,950 --> 00:28:52,480
in a society where

735
00:28:58,950 --> 00:28:54,960
everything occurs at

736
00:29:02,470 --> 00:28:58,960
more of a cognitive level than uh in in

737
00:29:05,669 --> 00:29:02,480
the kind of emotionality and full body

738
00:29:06,789 --> 00:29:05,679
spectrum that we have as humans

739
00:29:08,710 --> 00:29:06,799
however

740
00:29:10,070 --> 00:29:08,720
you know you have to realize that we

741
00:29:13,830 --> 00:29:10,080
killed

742
00:29:16,230 --> 00:29:13,840
nearly 200 million of our own kind in

743
00:29:17,990 --> 00:29:16,240
major and minor wars during the 20th

744
00:29:20,870 --> 00:29:18,000
century

745
00:29:22,549 --> 00:29:20,880
we exploded

746
00:29:25,029 --> 00:29:22,559
dozens of

747
00:29:27,190 --> 00:29:25,039
atomic weapons

748
00:29:29,669 --> 00:29:27,200
what they told susie hansen an

749
00:29:31,669 --> 00:29:29,679
experiencer from new zealand

750
00:29:35,669 --> 00:29:31,679
is that when

751
00:29:38,389 --> 00:29:35,679
they saw that occurring on earth

752
00:29:42,070 --> 00:29:38,399
they actually saw the earth's magnetic

753
00:29:44,230 --> 00:29:42,080
field exploding outwards reverberating

754
00:29:47,590 --> 00:29:44,240
throughout the solar system and into the

755
00:29:49,830 --> 00:29:47,600
galaxy and that this was a very bad

756
00:29:50,789 --> 00:29:49,840
thing let me ask you that though this is

757
00:29:52,830 --> 00:29:50,799
a claim

758
00:29:56,710 --> 00:29:52,840
made sometimes is there any scientific

759
00:29:59,590 --> 00:29:56,720
evidence that our nuclear weapons tests

760
00:30:01,190 --> 00:29:59,600
could impact anything other than earth

761
00:30:05,430 --> 00:30:01,200
i don't know if there's scientific

762
00:30:07,669 --> 00:30:05,440
evidence of that now or not if there is

763
00:30:10,310 --> 00:30:07,679
uh stanton friedman has not mentioned

764
00:30:13,029 --> 00:30:10,320
that to me and i haven't read it

765
00:30:14,950 --> 00:30:13,039
anywhere but that is what this

766
00:30:17,430 --> 00:30:14,960
experiencer

767
00:30:19,830 --> 00:30:17,440
has been told and she's sort of on the

768
00:30:22,389 --> 00:30:19,840
other end of the spectrum from david

769
00:30:24,950 --> 00:30:22,399
jacobs this is what bothers me about

770
00:30:26,310 --> 00:30:24,960
this whole thing if et is so

771
00:30:28,070 --> 00:30:26,320
all-powerful

772
00:30:30,070 --> 00:30:28,080
why can't they come here and enforce

773
00:30:32,549 --> 00:30:30,080
their wishes on us

774
00:30:35,510 --> 00:30:32,559
what they have been telling the

775
00:30:36,470 --> 00:30:35,520
experiencers that i've worked with is

776
00:30:39,350 --> 00:30:36,480
that

777
00:30:43,190 --> 00:30:39,360
they are working quietly

778
00:30:45,269 --> 00:30:43,200
in an attempt not to be too disruptive

779
00:30:47,990 --> 00:30:45,279
to human society

780
00:30:48,830 --> 00:30:48,000
they say that they

781
00:30:51,590 --> 00:30:48,840
take

782
00:30:53,110 --> 00:30:51,600
individuals at night when they're

783
00:30:56,470 --> 00:30:53,120
sleeping

784
00:30:59,430 --> 00:30:56,480
in order to reduce the level of trauma

785
00:31:01,909 --> 00:30:59,440
that humans are experiencing

786
00:31:03,110 --> 00:31:01,919
now the other side could look at that

787
00:31:06,070 --> 00:31:03,120
and say

788
00:31:08,710 --> 00:31:06,080
they're doing it at night

789
00:31:11,110 --> 00:31:08,720
to try to prevent you from knowing the

790
00:31:14,310 --> 00:31:11,120
damage that they're doing to you and

791
00:31:18,470 --> 00:31:14,320
your level of trauma is still there

792
00:31:22,389 --> 00:31:18,480
as a result of what is occurring to you

793
00:31:24,789 --> 00:31:22,399
at a subconscious level even if it isn't

794
00:31:26,950 --> 00:31:24,799
occurring consciously

795
00:31:29,190 --> 00:31:26,960
we have this dichotomy

796
00:31:32,149 --> 00:31:29,200
and we really don't know

797
00:31:36,070 --> 00:31:32,159
what is going on but these ets are

798
00:31:39,269 --> 00:31:36,080
explaining this as uh as if they are

799
00:31:41,350 --> 00:31:39,279
benevolent as if they are caring about

800
00:31:44,710 --> 00:31:41,360
the earth's people

801
00:31:46,710 --> 00:31:44,720
but very very concerned about our

802
00:31:50,230 --> 00:31:46,720
malevolent behavior

803
00:31:51,909 --> 00:31:50,240
very concerned that if we continue on

804
00:31:53,590 --> 00:31:51,919
the same course

805
00:31:56,310 --> 00:31:53,600
that we could

806
00:31:59,190 --> 00:31:56,320
uh create an environmental disaster that

807
00:32:01,110 --> 00:31:59,200
would lead to our extinction

808
00:32:04,549 --> 00:32:01,120
why believe them why should we believe

809
00:32:07,269 --> 00:32:04,559
e.t they say that to us if it is e.t

810
00:32:10,710 --> 00:32:07,279
it's a funny thing bud hopkins said to

811
00:32:13,029 --> 00:32:10,720
me kathy never trust an e.t never

812
00:32:17,110 --> 00:32:13,039
believe a word that they say

813
00:32:20,310 --> 00:32:17,120
yet so many individuals do

814
00:32:23,430 --> 00:32:20,320
trust and do believe and if you look

815
00:32:27,029 --> 00:32:23,440
around the earth and and you look at the

816
00:32:29,350 --> 00:32:27,039
behavior of humans on earth it certainly

817
00:32:31,509 --> 00:32:29,360
is very troubling

818
00:32:33,590 --> 00:32:31,519
it's certainly irrational too i mean

819
00:32:35,110 --> 00:32:33,600
we've reached a point in our society

820
00:32:37,990 --> 00:32:35,120
where people will

821
00:32:39,509 --> 00:32:38,000
recite bald-faced lies

822
00:32:41,110 --> 00:32:39,519
as if they're true

823
00:32:43,310 --> 00:32:41,120
and people will accept it and i'm not

824
00:32:46,389 --> 00:32:43,320
going to get too involved in the

825
00:32:47,990 --> 00:32:46,399
2016 presidential campaign in the us but

826
00:32:50,230 --> 00:32:48,000
you get the picture here

827
00:32:51,990 --> 00:32:50,240
yes absolutely and and it's very

828
00:32:54,710 --> 00:32:52,000
unfortunate that

829
00:32:56,549 --> 00:32:54,720
our society has

830
00:32:59,350 --> 00:32:56,559
taken this turn

831
00:33:02,549 --> 00:32:59,360
when i was growing up you could

832
00:33:05,669 --> 00:33:02,559
believe what your neighbor told you

833
00:33:08,310 --> 00:33:05,679
you could make a deal on a handshake

834
00:33:10,710 --> 00:33:08,320
in the town that i grew up in we didn't

835
00:33:13,190 --> 00:33:10,720
lock our doors we didn't lock our car

836
00:33:16,310 --> 00:33:13,200
doors

837
00:33:17,909 --> 00:33:16,320
there was virtually no crime that i was

838
00:33:20,149 --> 00:33:17,919
aware of

839
00:33:22,149 --> 00:33:20,159
it was a small town it wasn't a big city

840
00:33:23,029 --> 00:33:22,159
i'm sure it was different in the big

841
00:33:28,630 --> 00:33:23,039
city

842
00:33:31,269 --> 00:33:28,640
but if i go back to that same town now

843
00:33:33,909 --> 00:33:31,279
there are crimes being committed you

844
00:33:36,389 --> 00:33:33,919
have to lock your car you have to lock

845
00:33:40,789 --> 00:33:36,399
your house you're not safe walking down

846
00:33:42,870 --> 00:33:40,799
the street at night so we certainly have

847
00:33:45,750 --> 00:33:42,880
taken a turn for the worse

848
00:33:47,990 --> 00:33:45,760
and i don't know what the answer to that

849
00:33:49,110 --> 00:33:48,000
is we've certainly lost

850
00:33:54,950 --> 00:33:49,120
our

851
00:33:58,070 --> 00:33:54,960
on a societal level

852
00:33:59,750 --> 00:33:58,080
yet we have so much goodness going on

853
00:34:01,830 --> 00:33:59,760
at the same time

854
00:34:02,789 --> 00:34:01,840
think of the goodness that

855
00:34:06,230 --> 00:34:02,799
mother

856
00:34:07,350 --> 00:34:06,240
teresa for example bestowed upon this

857
00:34:08,310 --> 00:34:07,360
world

858
00:34:09,270 --> 00:34:08,320
think of

859
00:34:12,310 --> 00:34:09,280
other

860
00:34:14,550 --> 00:34:12,320
leaders who have been so kind and so

861
00:34:16,069 --> 00:34:14,560
fair martin luther king

862
00:34:18,550 --> 00:34:16,079
for example

863
00:34:19,430 --> 00:34:18,560
so you have

864
00:34:21,909 --> 00:34:19,440
these

865
00:34:23,589 --> 00:34:21,919
wonderful examples of human beings that

866
00:34:26,950 --> 00:34:23,599
we look up to

867
00:34:29,190 --> 00:34:26,960
yet our society is crumbling at the same

868
00:34:31,589 --> 00:34:29,200
time and i think that a lot of this uh

869
00:34:33,589 --> 00:34:31,599
has to do with drug involvement we have

870
00:34:34,470 --> 00:34:33,599
a very huge

871
00:34:36,710 --> 00:34:34,480
problem

872
00:34:39,349 --> 00:34:36,720
in this country last night i heard on

873
00:34:42,230 --> 00:34:39,359
the news that the state of new hampshire

874
00:34:45,190 --> 00:34:42,240
the state i grew up in the state where

875
00:34:48,550 --> 00:34:45,200
we didn't have to lock doors and where

876
00:34:51,589 --> 00:34:48,560
we had almost no crime has the most

877
00:34:53,589 --> 00:34:51,599
serious heroin addiction problem in the

878
00:34:55,109 --> 00:34:53,599
united states

879
00:34:57,349 --> 00:34:55,119
of course that raises a question we

880
00:34:59,670 --> 00:34:57,359
really won't deal with here which is why

881
00:35:02,870 --> 00:34:59,680
people become addicted to drugs i mean

882
00:35:03,829 --> 00:35:02,880
just mild stuff or someone drinks a beer

883
00:35:05,589 --> 00:35:03,839
or

884
00:35:07,510 --> 00:35:05,599
maybe has

885
00:35:09,109 --> 00:35:07,520
another kind of drink like something

886
00:35:11,670 --> 00:35:09,119
that's shaken not stirred if you know

887
00:35:13,589 --> 00:35:11,680
what i mean or maybe smoke something on

888
00:35:15,349 --> 00:35:13,599
a rare occasion

889
00:35:17,109 --> 00:35:15,359
isn't harming themselves

890
00:35:18,310 --> 00:35:17,119
that's part and parcel of our experience

891
00:35:20,710 --> 00:35:18,320
when it becomes

892
00:35:22,470 --> 00:35:20,720
extreme it gets difficult all right

893
00:35:23,990 --> 00:35:22,480
we're talking about these extreme

894
00:35:25,670 --> 00:35:24,000
interpretations

895
00:35:27,510 --> 00:35:25,680
of abduction events and we'll get into

896
00:35:30,790 --> 00:35:27,520
more of this as we progress

897
00:35:32,550 --> 00:35:30,800
the other thing i've asked about before

898
00:35:34,390 --> 00:35:32,560
and maybe you can consider this and this

899
00:35:36,550 --> 00:35:34,400
goes back to john keel and this

900
00:35:39,910 --> 00:35:36,560
reflective factor

901
00:35:41,750 --> 00:35:39,920
that researchers of paranormal events

902
00:35:43,589 --> 00:35:41,760
attract the cases

903
00:35:45,190 --> 00:35:43,599
they believe in that validate their

904
00:35:47,030 --> 00:35:45,200
theories

905
00:35:48,310 --> 00:35:47,040
and i kind of think of this way in

906
00:35:50,710 --> 00:35:48,320
looking at

907
00:35:52,630 --> 00:35:50,720
the work done by dr david jacobs who

908
00:35:55,670 --> 00:35:52,640
feels all the cases validate what he

909
00:35:58,950 --> 00:35:55,680
does or a dr leo sprinkle where

910
00:36:00,630 --> 00:35:58,960
e.t is nice and warm and fuzzy

911
00:36:04,150 --> 00:36:00,640
what do you think

912
00:36:06,710 --> 00:36:04,160
i do think that experiencers gravitate

913
00:36:08,390 --> 00:36:06,720
toward researchers

914
00:36:11,430 --> 00:36:08,400
who

915
00:36:14,310 --> 00:36:11,440
will confirm their experiences

916
00:36:16,550 --> 00:36:14,320
so in short what that means is

917
00:36:18,790 --> 00:36:16,560
by doing that by going to researchers

918
00:36:20,550 --> 00:36:18,800
who seem to confirm their experiences

919
00:36:22,310 --> 00:36:20,560
they are leading the researchers to

920
00:36:24,790 --> 00:36:22,320
conclude that's what the experience is

921
00:36:27,109 --> 00:36:24,800
that there are no variations and maybe

922
00:36:29,510 --> 00:36:27,119
therefore make them more skeptical

923
00:36:30,470 --> 00:36:29,520
or puts them into a little bubble where

924
00:36:32,390 --> 00:36:30,480
it's like

925
00:36:34,230 --> 00:36:32,400
a loop system where they just

926
00:36:35,750 --> 00:36:34,240
they're being fed back

927
00:36:37,270 --> 00:36:35,760
what they expect to come out of this

928
00:36:39,349 --> 00:36:37,280
research we'll get into more of that in

929
00:36:41,589 --> 00:36:39,359
the implications in a moment kathleen

930
00:36:48,630 --> 00:36:41,599
martin joining gene and chris you're in

931
00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:53,270
thank you for listening to gcn

932
00:36:58,710 --> 00:36:56,510
visit gcnlive.com today

933
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of the 800-287-7180-800-287-7180

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encyclopedia in other books you're

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so check out after the powercast our

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second radio show the ad free version of

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a couple of the most important shows

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of the nearly 10-year existence of the

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power cast the transcripts are posted

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rates at plus.powercast.com

1049
00:41:55,990 --> 00:41:54,960
we have abduction researcher kathleen

1050
00:41:58,150 --> 00:41:56,000
martin

1051
00:42:00,550 --> 00:41:58,160
and we were talking here about

1052
00:42:02,470 --> 00:42:00,560
what these abductions might mean whether

1053
00:42:05,589 --> 00:42:02,480
et's here trying to

1054
00:42:07,829 --> 00:42:05,599
help us not to harm us to send us on the

1055
00:42:09,190 --> 00:42:07,839
street and the narrow

1056
00:42:11,430 --> 00:42:09,200
now one

1057
00:42:14,230 --> 00:42:11,440
thing that's raised occasionally in ufo

1058
00:42:15,270 --> 00:42:14,240
research is the human race was the human

1059
00:42:17,030 --> 00:42:15,280
race

1060
00:42:18,150 --> 00:42:17,040
actually at one time

1061
00:42:19,349 --> 00:42:18,160
seeded

1062
00:42:21,109 --> 00:42:19,359
by e.t

1063
00:42:23,829 --> 00:42:21,119
explaining maybe the appearance of the

1064
00:42:27,430 --> 00:42:23,839
so-called ancient astronauts that we are

1065
00:42:29,510 --> 00:42:27,440
in a sense e.t or et's experiment and if

1066
00:42:31,589 --> 00:42:29,520
that's the case wouldn't e.t if they

1067
00:42:32,790 --> 00:42:31,599
came here today feel in ownership with

1068
00:42:35,990 --> 00:42:32,800
us anyway

1069
00:42:38,309 --> 00:42:36,000
they probably would if that is true

1070
00:42:40,230 --> 00:42:38,319
and if you go back to the statements

1071
00:42:44,470 --> 00:42:40,240
that were made by

1072
00:42:47,829 --> 00:42:44,480
major general sanford back in 1952

1073
00:42:50,230 --> 00:42:47,839
at the largest press conference uh since

1074
00:42:53,270 --> 00:42:50,240
world war ii and this was

1075
00:42:55,190 --> 00:42:53,280
in july of 1950

1076
00:42:57,670 --> 00:42:55,200
to after

1077
00:42:58,870 --> 00:42:57,680
so many ufos were seen over washington

1078
00:43:02,230 --> 00:42:58,880
dc

1079
00:43:04,870 --> 00:43:02,240
and what he stated to the press is that

1080
00:43:07,990 --> 00:43:04,880
throughout human history

1081
00:43:10,870 --> 00:43:08,000
this type of phenomenon has occurred

1082
00:43:12,630 --> 00:43:10,880
it's been seen in the skies they

1083
00:43:15,109 --> 00:43:12,640
couldn't explain it

1084
00:43:17,510 --> 00:43:15,119
but uh it

1085
00:43:21,190 --> 00:43:17,520
appeared to be real

1086
00:43:24,950 --> 00:43:21,200
uh it appeared not to be harmful to

1087
00:43:27,270 --> 00:43:24,960
humans on earth and then he spoke about

1088
00:43:28,589 --> 00:43:27,280
a sighting going back into

1089
00:43:34,150 --> 00:43:28,599
the

1090
00:43:39,109 --> 00:43:34,160
again about

1091
00:43:42,550 --> 00:43:39,119
how in 19 i believe it was 1934

1092
00:43:43,990 --> 00:43:42,560
uh ufos started to be seen

1093
00:43:46,390 --> 00:43:44,000
in sweden

1094
00:43:49,670 --> 00:43:46,400
and that the air force had taken an

1095
00:43:52,790 --> 00:43:49,680
interest in this because credible people

1096
00:43:53,750 --> 00:43:52,800
were reporting incredible things

1097
00:43:55,589 --> 00:43:53,760
so

1098
00:43:57,270 --> 00:43:55,599
the air force at that point was

1099
00:43:59,829 --> 00:43:57,280
admitting

1100
00:44:03,670 --> 00:43:59,839
that these things were going on

1101
00:44:05,190 --> 00:44:03,680
perhaps they have been

1102
00:44:07,190 --> 00:44:05,200
guiding us

1103
00:44:09,670 --> 00:44:07,200
perhaps they seated us

1104
00:44:10,390 --> 00:44:09,680
and perhaps they've have checked up on

1105
00:44:13,829 --> 00:44:10,400
us

1106
00:44:14,950 --> 00:44:13,839
from time to time throughout our history

1107
00:44:16,150 --> 00:44:14,960
and

1108
00:44:19,190 --> 00:44:16,160
after

1109
00:44:21,349 --> 00:44:19,200
the wars that occurred during the 20th

1110
00:44:26,470 --> 00:44:21,359
century

1111
00:44:29,910 --> 00:44:26,480
many weapons

1112
00:44:33,589 --> 00:44:29,920
and the development of more technology

1113
00:44:35,589 --> 00:44:33,599
the development of nuclear weapons

1114
00:44:36,550 --> 00:44:35,599
if i were looking

1115
00:44:42,150 --> 00:44:36,560
at

1116
00:44:45,030 --> 00:44:42,160
another planet i think i'd be concerned

1117
00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:45,040
and i think that i would probably

1118
00:44:47,750 --> 00:44:46,319
watch

1119
00:44:50,470 --> 00:44:47,760
and i would wait

1120
00:44:52,630 --> 00:44:50,480
and i would be very careful and i would

1121
00:44:55,670 --> 00:44:52,640
determine whether i was going to let

1122
00:44:58,790 --> 00:44:55,680
these idiots just kill themselves and

1123
00:45:02,150 --> 00:44:58,800
wipe out life on this beautiful planet

1124
00:45:05,589 --> 00:45:02,160
or if at some point i was going to

1125
00:45:06,870 --> 00:45:05,599
intervene and how i would do that

1126
00:45:11,270 --> 00:45:06,880
would i

1127
00:45:13,670 --> 00:45:11,280
want to attempt to bring about small

1128
00:45:16,550 --> 00:45:13,680
evolutionary changes

1129
00:45:20,150 --> 00:45:16,560
in these individuals by

1130
00:45:22,630 --> 00:45:20,160
perhaps taking them on board my craft

1131
00:45:25,670 --> 00:45:22,640
and doing genetic experiments

1132
00:45:28,230 --> 00:45:25,680
and perhaps changing

1133
00:45:30,390 --> 00:45:28,240
their altering their dna

1134
00:45:32,069 --> 00:45:30,400
to a certain degree

1135
00:45:33,349 --> 00:45:32,079
i would have to be very very

1136
00:45:34,950 --> 00:45:33,359
knowledgeable

1137
00:45:36,150 --> 00:45:34,960
about genetics

1138
00:45:39,589 --> 00:45:36,160
and

1139
00:45:40,870 --> 00:45:39,599
apparently these ets are from all of the

1140
00:45:42,950 --> 00:45:40,880
information

1141
00:45:45,349 --> 00:45:42,960
that we've received and some of this is

1142
00:45:47,270 --> 00:45:45,359
from conscious recall i'm not saying

1143
00:45:51,430 --> 00:45:47,280
that all of this is retrieved through

1144
00:45:53,990 --> 00:45:51,440
hypnosis there are experiencers who do

1145
00:45:57,349 --> 00:45:54,000
remember their experiences and some

1146
00:45:59,030 --> 00:45:57,359
credible people as well well if you

1147
00:46:00,309 --> 00:45:59,040
would say that to david jacobs he would

1148
00:46:01,910 --> 00:46:00,319
say that they're making it up that

1149
00:46:04,230 --> 00:46:01,920
they're not real events

1150
00:46:04,950 --> 00:46:04,240
that that does not conform to

1151
00:46:06,630 --> 00:46:04,960
you know

1152
00:46:08,230 --> 00:46:06,640
i i had a conversation with him when i

1153
00:46:09,589 --> 00:46:08,240
when i first met him and i said i had an

1154
00:46:12,470 --> 00:46:09,599
incredible case

1155
00:46:14,150 --> 00:46:12,480
uh the woman had complete well not maybe

1156
00:46:16,630 --> 00:46:14,160
complete but quite a bit of her

1157
00:46:18,309 --> 00:46:16,640
experiences she could recall and jacob

1158
00:46:20,230 --> 00:46:18,319
scoffed and walked away muttering

1159
00:46:22,870 --> 00:46:20,240
something about well she's just hoaxing

1160
00:46:23,910 --> 00:46:22,880
you or she's punking you or whatever and

1161
00:46:26,550 --> 00:46:23,920
uh

1162
00:46:29,750 --> 00:46:26,560
so it's kind of hard to reconcile

1163
00:46:32,390 --> 00:46:29,760
one methodology and one

1164
00:46:35,430 --> 00:46:32,400
set of of beliefs around this phenomenon

1165
00:46:37,990 --> 00:46:35,440
by a researcher that totally negates

1166
00:46:39,589 --> 00:46:38,000
anything that doesn't conform to his his

1167
00:46:40,870 --> 00:46:39,599
what he considers his foregone

1168
00:46:41,670 --> 00:46:40,880
conclusions

1169
00:46:43,109 --> 00:46:41,680
so

1170
00:46:44,630 --> 00:46:43,119
have you ever mentioned to jacobs that

1171
00:46:47,190 --> 00:46:44,640
you have cases where

1172
00:46:48,230 --> 00:46:47,200
your experiences actually have conscious

1173
00:46:51,510 --> 00:46:48,240
recall

1174
00:46:55,589 --> 00:46:51,520
i certainly have i've i have spoken to

1175
00:46:58,950 --> 00:46:55,599
david uh at length about his uh met the

1176
00:47:01,270 --> 00:46:58,960
methodology he uses in hypnosis and also

1177
00:47:04,230 --> 00:47:01,280
about uh conscious recall of

1178
00:47:07,430 --> 00:47:04,240
experiencers and he did tell me that he

1179
00:47:09,990 --> 00:47:07,440
believed that

1180
00:47:13,430 --> 00:47:10,000
conscious recall it was not actual

1181
00:47:15,829 --> 00:47:13,440
recall and that the recall

1182
00:47:19,270 --> 00:47:15,839
retrieved through hypnosis

1183
00:47:20,230 --> 00:47:19,280
was more valid than the conscious recall

1184
00:47:24,470 --> 00:47:20,240
well

1185
00:47:28,470 --> 00:47:24,480
i have i in fact i have used hypnosis

1186
00:47:31,750 --> 00:47:28,480
only on individuals who had conscious

1187
00:47:34,390 --> 00:47:31,760
recall and evidence i would never

1188
00:47:38,790 --> 00:47:34,400
hypnotize anybody who didn't have

1189
00:47:41,109 --> 00:47:38,800
conscious recall and evidence and

1190
00:47:42,630 --> 00:47:41,119
hopefully another witness so that i who

1191
00:47:46,309 --> 00:47:42,640
had amnesia

1192
00:47:48,630 --> 00:47:46,319
uh for part of this and that so that i

1193
00:47:49,990 --> 00:47:48,640
could compare the statements

1194
00:47:52,630 --> 00:47:50,000
of the two

1195
00:47:55,190 --> 00:47:52,640
and that's what i did in the case of ed

1196
00:47:59,030 --> 00:47:55,200
and denise stoner they had conscious

1197
00:48:02,230 --> 00:47:59,040
continuous recall for uh the beginning

1198
00:48:04,870 --> 00:48:02,240
of this abduction that that they had

1199
00:48:05,829 --> 00:48:04,880
they had the conscious continuous recall

1200
00:48:08,950 --> 00:48:05,839
of

1201
00:48:11,750 --> 00:48:08,960
being in one location and then three

1202
00:48:14,230 --> 00:48:11,760
hours later finding themselves

1203
00:48:17,670 --> 00:48:14,240
in a completely different location it

1204
00:48:19,430 --> 00:48:17,680
didn't register on their odometer

1205
00:48:22,710 --> 00:48:19,440
it had been

1206
00:48:24,549 --> 00:48:22,720
daylight bright sun when they were taken

1207
00:48:27,510 --> 00:48:24,559
when they were returned to a new

1208
00:48:29,910 --> 00:48:27,520
location 40 miles down the road it was

1209
00:48:32,230 --> 00:48:29,920
pitch black and they were freezing there

1210
00:48:34,870 --> 00:48:32,240
were people on the other end who were

1211
00:48:37,190 --> 00:48:34,880
waiting for them to serve them dinner

1212
00:48:39,270 --> 00:48:37,200
and obviously they ended up being very

1213
00:48:41,430 --> 00:48:39,280
very late and and it was very

1214
00:48:42,790 --> 00:48:41,440
distressing for everybody

1215
00:48:43,589 --> 00:48:42,800
involved

1216
00:48:45,750 --> 00:48:43,599
but

1217
00:48:49,190 --> 00:48:45,760
what i'm i want to say

1218
00:48:50,230 --> 00:48:49,200
is the conscious recall remained the

1219
00:48:53,510 --> 00:48:50,240
same

1220
00:48:55,510 --> 00:48:53,520
under hypnosis maybe you could fill in a

1221
00:48:57,829 --> 00:48:55,520
few more details

1222
00:48:59,109 --> 00:48:57,839
but it remained the same

1223
00:49:03,829 --> 00:48:59,119
i

1224
00:49:05,829 --> 00:49:03,839
recall

1225
00:49:07,589 --> 00:49:05,839
must be incorrect

1226
00:49:09,349 --> 00:49:07,599
if it's a dream that's recalled that's

1227
00:49:11,190 --> 00:49:09,359
something different but if you're

1228
00:49:12,390 --> 00:49:11,200
talking about conscious continuous

1229
00:49:15,589 --> 00:49:12,400
recall

1230
00:49:18,470 --> 00:49:15,599
i think that it is more valid than

1231
00:49:19,910 --> 00:49:18,480
information retrieved through hypnosis

1232
00:49:20,790 --> 00:49:19,920
particularly

1233
00:49:22,870 --> 00:49:20,800
if

1234
00:49:25,190 --> 00:49:22,880
leading questions are asked and that's

1235
00:49:27,670 --> 00:49:25,200
not something that i ever do

1236
00:49:30,309 --> 00:49:27,680
now that also that's also by the way

1237
00:49:33,990 --> 00:49:30,319
kathleen an issue where we got into kind

1238
00:49:35,750 --> 00:49:34,000
of oh boy yes discussion with dr jacobs

1239
00:49:36,870 --> 00:49:35,760
because he makes a couple of points here

1240
00:49:39,349 --> 00:49:36,880
to him

1241
00:49:40,950 --> 00:49:39,359
hypnosis is just relaxation he doesn't

1242
00:49:43,589 --> 00:49:40,960
seem to believe in a trans state or

1243
00:49:45,750 --> 00:49:43,599
anything like that and second he says

1244
00:49:48,390 --> 00:49:45,760
there are no leading questions if you

1245
00:49:50,309 --> 00:49:48,400
ask someone something that leads them in

1246
00:49:51,910 --> 00:49:50,319
a direction that is other

1247
00:49:54,309 --> 00:49:51,920
than what they believe their experience

1248
00:49:56,710 --> 00:49:54,319
to point to they'll simply say no that's

1249
00:49:58,470 --> 00:49:56,720
not what happened you cannot ask leading

1250
00:50:01,589 --> 00:49:58,480
questions according to him

1251
00:50:03,829 --> 00:50:01,599
well if you look at the transcripts

1252
00:50:05,510 --> 00:50:03,839
of hypnosis session

1253
00:50:09,270 --> 00:50:05,520
if you ask

1254
00:50:11,270 --> 00:50:09,280
an individual a pointed question

1255
00:50:15,190 --> 00:50:11,280
let me give you an example

1256
00:50:18,710 --> 00:50:15,200
this is what i do under hypnosis

1257
00:50:19,990 --> 00:50:18,720
let me use denise as an example again

1258
00:50:25,910 --> 00:50:20,000
she

1259
00:50:28,470 --> 00:50:25,920
herself standing on the craft this is

1260
00:50:30,950 --> 00:50:28,480
after she was taken in

1261
00:50:33,109 --> 00:50:30,960
i didn't say look around and tell me

1262
00:50:36,230 --> 00:50:33,119
what you see

1263
00:50:38,069 --> 00:50:36,240
i didn't say what was the lighting like

1264
00:50:40,309 --> 00:50:38,079
i said

1265
00:50:42,309 --> 00:50:40,319
do you see anything

1266
00:50:43,589 --> 00:50:42,319
if i said look around and tell me what

1267
00:50:45,990 --> 00:50:43,599
you see

1268
00:50:49,829 --> 00:50:46,000
she could confabulate because i don't

1269
00:50:51,990 --> 00:50:49,839
know if her eyes are open or not

1270
00:50:55,270 --> 00:50:52,000
now that's the point i try to make you

1271
00:50:57,190 --> 00:50:55,280
can and and david said well how

1272
00:51:00,470 --> 00:50:57,200
what kathy will will you get any

1273
00:51:02,710 --> 00:51:00,480
information if you don't ask questions

1274
00:51:04,710 --> 00:51:02,720
and i said well

1275
00:51:09,190 --> 00:51:04,720
it's because

1276
00:51:12,710 --> 00:51:09,200
i only build upon what has already said

1277
00:51:15,430 --> 00:51:12,720
and i say what happened next

1278
00:51:18,710 --> 00:51:15,440
do you see anything

1279
00:51:24,069 --> 00:51:21,430
and and it takes longer but i think it's

1280
00:51:25,670 --> 00:51:24,079
pure i i really

1281
00:51:27,270 --> 00:51:25,680
non-specificity

1282
00:51:28,790 --> 00:51:27,280
let's have the answer to that question

1283
00:51:31,030 --> 00:51:28,800
our next segment

1284
00:51:39,190 --> 00:51:31,040
kathleen martin with gene and chris

1285
00:51:43,309 --> 00:51:42,390
thank you for listening to gcn

1286
00:51:47,990 --> 00:51:43,319
visit

1287
00:51:52,309 --> 00:51:50,630
ray perkins a reclusive veteran burned

1288
00:51:54,790 --> 00:51:52,319
out from the gulf war

1289
00:51:56,069 --> 00:51:54,800
lives tortured by relentless perplexing

1290
00:52:00,069 --> 00:51:56,079
nightmares

1291
00:52:02,150 --> 00:52:00,079
space and of a mysterious woman

1292
00:52:03,030 --> 00:52:02,160
suffering in agony for her devastated

1293
00:52:05,670 --> 00:52:03,040
world

1294
00:52:08,549 --> 00:52:05,680
a woman not yet born calling across

1295
00:52:09,430 --> 00:52:08,559
centuries to him

1296
00:52:11,750 --> 00:52:09,440
then

1297
00:52:14,790 --> 00:52:11,760
a coincidence leads him to his destiny

1298
00:52:16,470 --> 00:52:14,800
his chance to alter the universe attack

1299
00:52:18,309 --> 00:52:16,480
attack of the rock

1300
00:52:20,870 --> 00:52:18,319
the former fiction editor for star wars

1301
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and indiana jones robert simpson writes

1302
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1311
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1337
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1340
00:53:59,589 --> 00:53:56,390
[Applause]

1341
00:54:03,270 --> 00:53:59,599
welcome back to the paracast the gold

1342
00:54:04,549 --> 00:54:03,280
standard of paranormal radio

1343
00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:04,559
and now

1344
00:54:11,430 --> 00:54:07,850
here's gene steinberg

1345
00:54:16,790 --> 00:54:13,670
so the question asked here of course is

1346
00:54:18,230 --> 00:54:16,800
about the hypnotic process about asking

1347
00:54:20,950 --> 00:54:18,240
leading questions

1348
00:54:22,950 --> 00:54:20,960
etc etc now it sounds to me kathleen

1349
00:54:25,910 --> 00:54:22,960
martin as if you have to be really

1350
00:54:27,190 --> 00:54:25,920
really circumspect in questioning

1351
00:54:29,270 --> 00:54:27,200
someone

1352
00:54:31,430 --> 00:54:29,280
who's under hypnosis because the

1353
00:54:34,069 --> 00:54:31,440
slightest misstep

1354
00:54:35,430 --> 00:54:34,079
and you can cause them to confabulate

1355
00:54:37,510 --> 00:54:35,440
entire

1356
00:54:39,750 --> 00:54:37,520
segments of their experience to

1357
00:54:41,910 --> 00:54:39,760
something other than what it is

1358
00:54:43,910 --> 00:54:41,920
now i gather here you have to undergo

1359
00:54:44,790 --> 00:54:43,920
extensive training to be able to do this

1360
00:54:47,349 --> 00:54:44,800
right

1361
00:54:49,430 --> 00:54:47,359
yes absolutely uh you have to have a

1362
00:54:53,510 --> 00:54:49,440
very good knowledge of psychology and

1363
00:54:55,430 --> 00:54:53,520
human behavior uh you also have to have

1364
00:54:57,270 --> 00:54:55,440
specialized training in forensic

1365
00:55:01,910 --> 00:54:57,280
hypnosis

1366
00:55:04,630 --> 00:55:01,920
trains you to

1367
00:55:07,750 --> 00:55:04,640
use this form of hypnosis

1368
00:55:11,510 --> 00:55:07,760
when hypnosis was admissible in a court

1369
00:55:13,910 --> 00:55:11,520
of law it was the only type of hypnosis

1370
00:55:16,549 --> 00:55:13,920
that was admissible

1371
00:55:20,710 --> 00:55:16,559
and that's why i felt that that was so

1372
00:55:23,430 --> 00:55:20,720
important knowing how easy it is to

1373
00:55:26,230 --> 00:55:23,440
induce people to confabulate an

1374
00:55:27,349 --> 00:55:26,240
experience i've undergone hypnosis

1375
00:55:29,190 --> 00:55:27,359
before

1376
00:55:32,390 --> 00:55:29,200
and i

1377
00:55:35,109 --> 00:55:32,400
know when the hypnotist is asking

1378
00:55:37,109 --> 00:55:35,119
leading questions and i have been asked

1379
00:55:38,470 --> 00:55:37,119
leading questions and it made me really

1380
00:55:41,349 --> 00:55:38,480
angry

1381
00:55:44,230 --> 00:55:41,359
i have to tell you that an individual

1382
00:55:46,390 --> 00:55:44,240
would ask leading questions

1383
00:55:47,750 --> 00:55:46,400
like that you don't get as much

1384
00:55:53,109 --> 00:55:47,760
information

1385
00:55:55,510 --> 00:55:53,119
believe is better and something else

1386
00:55:57,670 --> 00:55:55,520
that i have to tell you is that those of

1387
00:55:59,589 --> 00:55:57,680
us who work in this field

1388
00:56:02,230 --> 00:55:59,599
also withhold

1389
00:56:05,109 --> 00:56:02,240
some information from the general public

1390
00:56:06,470 --> 00:56:05,119
so that if we hear this information

1391
00:56:07,990 --> 00:56:06,480
being

1392
00:56:09,829 --> 00:56:08,000
discussed

1393
00:56:12,789 --> 00:56:09,839
or being brought forth

1394
00:56:15,270 --> 00:56:12,799
then it gives us an indication that this

1395
00:56:17,990 --> 00:56:15,280
experience might be real

1396
00:56:20,150 --> 00:56:18,000
but for me the important thing is to

1397
00:56:23,190 --> 00:56:20,160
have two individuals

1398
00:56:26,150 --> 00:56:23,200
who have undergone the same experience

1399
00:56:28,549 --> 00:56:26,160
and who have amnesia for part of that

1400
00:56:31,589 --> 00:56:28,559
experience so that i can compare

1401
00:56:33,750 --> 00:56:31,599
what they say dr simon did this with

1402
00:56:37,030 --> 00:56:33,760
betty and barney hill

1403
00:56:39,109 --> 00:56:37,040
walter webb wrote about this in his book

1404
00:56:40,549 --> 00:56:39,119
the buff ledge

1405
00:56:43,109 --> 00:56:40,559
abductions

1406
00:56:44,470 --> 00:56:43,119
where he actually did a probability

1407
00:56:45,829 --> 00:56:44,480
ratio

1408
00:56:48,630 --> 00:56:45,839
based upon

1409
00:56:51,349 --> 00:56:48,640
the percentage of information that

1410
00:56:54,470 --> 00:56:51,359
correlated between the two subjects who

1411
00:56:56,630 --> 00:56:54,480
both had amnesia for the abduction

1412
00:56:59,190 --> 00:56:56,640
itself i think that's very very

1413
00:57:01,430 --> 00:56:59,200
important because we really need to look

1414
00:57:05,349 --> 00:57:01,440
at the evidence when you have

1415
00:57:07,030 --> 00:57:05,359
individuals who are undergoing hypnosis

1416
00:57:09,349 --> 00:57:07,040
say they're wannabes

1417
00:57:10,789 --> 00:57:09,359
say that they might not have really had

1418
00:57:14,069 --> 00:57:10,799
an experience

1419
00:57:16,390 --> 00:57:14,079
there's a lot of available on the market

1420
00:57:18,870 --> 00:57:16,400
there's a lot available on the internet

1421
00:57:21,750 --> 00:57:18,880
you listen to radio programs the the

1422
00:57:22,870 --> 00:57:21,760
market is flooded with books

1423
00:57:28,309 --> 00:57:22,880
and

1424
00:57:29,190 --> 00:57:28,319
experience because you want to fit into

1425
00:57:32,470 --> 00:57:29,200
that

1426
00:57:35,430 --> 00:57:32,480
experience or group you can certainly do

1427
00:57:39,750 --> 00:57:35,440
that under hypnosis i mean you can lie

1428
00:57:42,230 --> 00:57:39,760
under hypnosis as easily as you can

1429
00:57:43,589 --> 00:57:42,240
in real life or when you're not in

1430
00:57:46,230 --> 00:57:43,599
hypnosis

1431
00:57:48,630 --> 00:57:46,240
but there is something that you can

1432
00:57:52,390 --> 00:57:48,640
state if you're a forensic hypno

1433
00:57:54,470 --> 00:57:52,400
hypnotist to that individual and you can

1434
00:57:57,270 --> 00:57:54,480
tell them that they

1435
00:57:58,789 --> 00:57:57,280
can only speak about those events that

1436
00:58:01,430 --> 00:57:58,799
really happened

1437
00:58:03,430 --> 00:58:01,440
and if they start to add

1438
00:58:05,990 --> 00:58:03,440
something that didn't

1439
00:58:07,430 --> 00:58:06,000
really happen then they will not be able

1440
00:58:10,230 --> 00:58:07,440
to speak

1441
00:58:12,630 --> 00:58:10,240
so that's just one little trick that

1442
00:58:15,510 --> 00:58:12,640
hypnotists might use

1443
00:58:17,589 --> 00:58:15,520
under forensic hypnosis

1444
00:58:19,190 --> 00:58:17,599
yeah well one thing that really

1445
00:58:21,750 --> 00:58:19,200
surprised me quite

1446
00:58:25,109 --> 00:58:21,760
set me back in my my chair a bit is when

1447
00:58:27,750 --> 00:58:25,119
asked dr jacobs or david jacobs

1448
00:58:30,710 --> 00:58:27,760
but jacob said oh no i've never had any

1449
00:58:32,630 --> 00:58:30,720
i took uh you know an afternoon i think

1450
00:58:34,549 --> 00:58:32,640
uh what do you say gene an afternoon or

1451
00:58:36,950 --> 00:58:34,559
a weekend workshop and i watched bud

1452
00:58:40,309 --> 00:58:36,960
hopkins for a couple of years

1453
00:58:42,950 --> 00:58:40,319
and that was his training and he very uh

1454
00:58:44,630 --> 00:58:42,960
a rather cavalier manner i must say said

1455
00:58:47,750 --> 00:58:44,640
oh yeah i ask leading questions all the

1456
00:58:49,910 --> 00:58:47,760
time to see if they'll fall for it

1457
00:58:52,470 --> 00:58:49,920
and and to me that that just smacks of

1458
00:58:54,069 --> 00:58:52,480
amateurism it's max of somebody that

1459
00:58:55,910 --> 00:58:54,079
really does not know

1460
00:58:57,510 --> 00:58:55,920
what they're doing and

1461
00:58:58,950 --> 00:58:57,520
especially doesn't have the methodology

1462
00:59:01,109 --> 00:58:58,960
of how to do it

1463
00:59:03,190 --> 00:59:01,119
and that's that's a double whammy that's

1464
00:59:06,390 --> 00:59:03,200
very difficult to surmount

1465
00:59:10,870 --> 00:59:06,400
well in training for forensic hypnosis

1466
00:59:12,150 --> 00:59:10,880
you are instructed to ask a question to

1467
00:59:14,950 --> 00:59:12,160
determine

1468
00:59:16,470 --> 00:59:14,960
uh how likely the individual is to

1469
00:59:18,470 --> 00:59:16,480
confabulate

1470
00:59:21,349 --> 00:59:18,480
so you could ask a question

1471
00:59:23,990 --> 00:59:21,359
or two that might be a little leading

1472
00:59:25,349 --> 00:59:24,000
where you would get an incorrect answer

1473
00:59:26,950 --> 00:59:25,359
and know that you're getting that

1474
00:59:30,549 --> 00:59:26,960
incorrect answer

1475
00:59:32,789 --> 00:59:30,559
um just to test that individual

1476
00:59:35,430 --> 00:59:32,799
but i do think that

1477
00:59:37,430 --> 00:59:35,440
certainly training and certification is

1478
00:59:38,630 --> 00:59:37,440
extremely important

1479
00:59:41,829 --> 00:59:38,640
and

1480
00:59:45,750 --> 00:59:41,839
i i have the greatest amount of respect

1481
00:59:48,390 --> 00:59:45,760
for those hypnotherapists who are also

1482
00:59:50,870 --> 00:59:48,400
licensed mental health therapists in the

1483
00:59:52,870 --> 00:59:50,880
state that they work in because they

1484
00:59:55,510 --> 00:59:52,880
have an extensive knowledge of human

1485
00:59:59,510 --> 00:59:55,520
psychology and also

1486
01:00:01,750 --> 00:59:59,520
of the use the proper use of hypnosis

1487
01:00:02,950 --> 01:00:01,760
and also i have to tell you

1488
01:00:06,549 --> 01:00:02,960
if you

1489
01:00:10,069 --> 01:00:06,559
take formal training in hypnosis

1490
01:00:13,589 --> 01:00:10,079
you will be taught that you should never

1491
01:00:15,910 --> 01:00:13,599
hypnotize anyone over the telephone or

1492
01:00:18,150 --> 01:00:15,920
via skype

1493
01:00:20,069 --> 01:00:18,160
okay i wanted to emphasize that well

1494
01:00:22,710 --> 01:00:20,079
part of it also i would see is how do

1495
01:00:24,630 --> 01:00:22,720
you observe what the person is doing

1496
01:00:25,829 --> 01:00:24,640
how do you know they're not just goofing

1497
01:00:29,030 --> 01:00:25,839
on you

1498
01:00:32,069 --> 01:00:29,040
well it's very very important that you

1499
01:00:34,630 --> 01:00:32,079
observe the person you need to look at

1500
01:00:36,150 --> 01:00:34,640
their body language at their facial

1501
01:00:37,589 --> 01:00:36,160
expressions

1502
01:00:39,750 --> 01:00:37,599
because

1503
01:00:42,950 --> 01:00:39,760
if you are bringing up

1504
01:00:46,230 --> 01:00:42,960
a very troubling memories

1505
01:00:49,430 --> 01:00:46,240
you want to have exert a lot of control

1506
01:00:52,309 --> 01:00:49,440
over that individual if that individual

1507
01:00:54,870 --> 01:00:52,319
has a a really hard time

1508
01:00:56,950 --> 01:00:54,880
with a particular moment while they're

1509
01:00:58,950 --> 01:00:56,960
under hypnosis how are you going to deal

1510
01:01:02,630 --> 01:00:58,960
with that if you're on the phone

1511
01:01:06,069 --> 01:01:02,640
that's my point exactly and that is why

1512
01:01:08,470 --> 01:01:06,079
we were taught when we underwent formal

1513
01:01:10,950 --> 01:01:08,480
training and many many hours of formal

1514
01:01:12,309 --> 01:01:10,960
training and many hours of practice we

1515
01:01:15,589 --> 01:01:12,319
were taught

1516
01:01:18,630 --> 01:01:15,599
that you never do this unless the person

1517
01:01:21,750 --> 01:01:18,640
is in the same room with you it brings

1518
01:01:24,390 --> 01:01:21,760
back memories of barney hill when he was

1519
01:01:25,990 --> 01:01:24,400
under hypnosis with dr simon

1520
01:01:27,510 --> 01:01:26,000
and he

1521
01:01:30,309 --> 01:01:27,520
was standing

1522
01:01:32,630 --> 01:01:30,319
in the field and he didn't want to go on

1523
01:01:35,510 --> 01:01:32,640
he did not want to remember any more of

1524
01:01:38,470 --> 01:01:35,520
this and dr simon was forcing him barney

1525
01:01:40,710 --> 01:01:38,480
actually got up out of his chair

1526
01:01:42,950 --> 01:01:40,720
and tried to run away

1527
01:01:45,109 --> 01:01:42,960
what happens if you have somebody on the

1528
01:01:45,910 --> 01:01:45,119
telephone or someone

1529
01:01:49,190 --> 01:01:45,920
uh

1530
01:01:50,829 --> 01:01:49,200
on in skype and that person wants to run

1531
01:01:52,390 --> 01:01:50,839
and jump out of the window of their

1532
01:01:53,829 --> 01:01:52,400
apartment i'd like to run out in front

1533
01:01:55,190 --> 01:01:53,839
of traffic

1534
01:01:57,990 --> 01:01:55,200
how do you do that

1535
01:02:00,549 --> 01:01:58,000
um also you can lose a telephone

1536
01:02:01,750 --> 01:02:00,559
connection you can lose a skype

1537
01:02:04,549 --> 01:02:01,760
connection

1538
01:02:05,349 --> 01:02:04,559
and an untrained hypnotist might tell

1539
01:02:07,990 --> 01:02:05,359
you

1540
01:02:11,030 --> 01:02:08,000
that oh well people wake up

1541
01:02:13,750 --> 01:02:11,040
anyway eventually well that's true

1542
01:02:15,510 --> 01:02:13,760
they will come out of hypnosis but it's

1543
01:02:18,950 --> 01:02:15,520
very important

1544
01:02:21,910 --> 01:02:18,960
not to leave a person traumatized or

1545
01:02:23,190 --> 01:02:21,920
troubled or experiencing a high level of

1546
01:02:25,190 --> 01:02:23,200
anxiety

1547
01:02:27,829 --> 01:02:25,200
something else you have to do is you

1548
01:02:31,510 --> 01:02:27,839
have to do an assessment of risk

1549
01:02:33,109 --> 01:02:31,520
on anyone before they undergo hypnosis

1550
01:02:36,390 --> 01:02:33,119
because if that person has a

1551
01:02:38,710 --> 01:02:36,400
pre-existing psychiatric condition

1552
01:02:40,230 --> 01:02:38,720
then that hypnosis session can

1553
01:02:41,270 --> 01:02:40,240
exacerbate

1554
01:02:45,270 --> 01:02:41,280
that

1555
01:02:49,430 --> 01:02:45,280
experience

1556
01:02:51,670 --> 01:02:49,440
more anxiety or even go into

1557
01:02:53,990 --> 01:02:51,680
the fulbright blown illness that could

1558
01:02:56,870 --> 01:02:54,000
result in hospitalization in a

1559
01:02:57,829 --> 01:02:56,880
psychiatric hospital so you want to be

1560
01:03:01,589 --> 01:02:57,839
very

1561
01:03:05,430 --> 01:03:01,599
experiences

1562
01:03:10,630 --> 01:03:07,990
so you could maybe make matters worse

1563
01:03:12,630 --> 01:03:10,640
than they already are this way if you

1564
01:03:14,470 --> 01:03:12,640
don't follow proper procedure so that

1565
01:03:16,470 --> 01:03:14,480
means for example if somebody lives 8

1566
01:03:18,630 --> 01:03:16,480
000 miles away from you

1567
01:03:20,470 --> 01:03:18,640
and needs your help

1568
01:03:22,470 --> 01:03:20,480
you can't hypnotize them on the phone i

1569
01:03:25,910 --> 01:03:22,480
suppose what you could do is have a

1570
01:03:28,470 --> 01:03:25,920
hypnotist in their area come to them

1571
01:03:29,990 --> 01:03:28,480
perform the sessions and maybe consult

1572
01:03:34,150 --> 01:03:30,000
with them to see what's going on and

1573
01:03:36,230 --> 01:03:34,160
maybe have the material you want

1574
01:03:38,470 --> 01:03:36,240
asked under this session but you're

1575
01:03:40,390 --> 01:03:38,480
making a very interesting point here we

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01:06:38,870 --> 01:06:36,559
you never imagined from where we shop to

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the family you want to protect look i've

1642
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made predictions like this before a few

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years ago i warned that the housing

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prices would collapse before that i

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warned that dot-com companies would

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crash and they did those who listened

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had a chance to save themselves but this

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has nothing to do with the stock market

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so the thing that you're

1680
01:08:17,590 --> 01:08:16,000
telling us here kathleen martin is that

1681
01:08:19,590 --> 01:08:17,600
this has to be done carefully the

1682
01:08:21,910 --> 01:08:19,600
process is delicate you can't be

1683
01:08:24,550 --> 01:08:21,920
cavalier about hypnotizing people

1684
01:08:26,870 --> 01:08:24,560
because you could cause more damage than

1685
01:08:29,669 --> 01:08:26,880
is already present is that correct

1686
01:08:31,590 --> 01:08:29,679
that is absolutely true and there was a

1687
01:08:34,789 --> 01:08:31,600
huge backlash against the use of

1688
01:08:37,829 --> 01:08:34,799
hypnosis back about 20 years ago

1689
01:08:39,349 --> 01:08:37,839
and it was because there were so many

1690
01:08:40,950 --> 01:08:39,359
amateurs

1691
01:08:43,269 --> 01:08:40,960
who uh

1692
01:08:45,590 --> 01:08:43,279
investigators who decided that they

1693
01:08:47,749 --> 01:08:45,600
would try hypnosis on individuals and

1694
01:08:51,110 --> 01:08:47,759
and in some instances

1695
01:08:53,349 --> 01:08:51,120
they left those individuals traumatized

1696
01:08:56,149 --> 01:08:53,359
and it was very very bad

1697
01:08:59,110 --> 01:08:56,159
they wanted to extract information but

1698
01:09:01,349 --> 01:08:59,120
they didn't care for that individual

1699
01:09:04,309 --> 01:09:01,359
emotionally they left them without

1700
01:09:06,870 --> 01:09:04,319
support and it was really a terrible

1701
01:09:09,749 --> 01:09:06,880
time and not only that

1702
01:09:13,189 --> 01:09:09,759
they might have left them with an event

1703
01:09:14,950 --> 01:09:13,199
that never really happened because they

1704
01:09:19,189 --> 01:09:14,960
might have been feeding

1705
01:09:21,910 --> 01:09:19,199
information to that experience or as

1706
01:09:23,749 --> 01:09:21,920
an authority figure themselves and the

1707
01:09:26,470 --> 01:09:23,759
experiencer might have been attempting

1708
01:09:27,990 --> 01:09:26,480
to please them or they might have been

1709
01:09:30,630 --> 01:09:28,000
led into

1710
01:09:32,470 --> 01:09:30,640
an experience that they never had

1711
01:09:35,110 --> 01:09:32,480
well that that really brings up an

1712
01:09:37,829 --> 01:09:35,120
interesting point that is not really

1713
01:09:39,749 --> 01:09:37,839
addressed very much in this particular

1714
01:09:41,349 --> 01:09:39,759
corner of the field and that is the

1715
01:09:43,590 --> 01:09:41,359
motivation

1716
01:09:45,590 --> 01:09:43,600
of the researcher i really have a

1717
01:09:49,110 --> 01:09:45,600
suspicion that if the researcher's

1718
01:09:51,990 --> 01:09:49,120
motivation isn't pure and isn't centered

1719
01:09:54,310 --> 01:09:52,000
and grounded around the concept

1720
01:09:57,590 --> 01:09:54,320
of helping somebody

1721
01:10:00,550 --> 01:09:57,600
deal with traumatic experiences and with

1722
01:10:03,189 --> 01:10:00,560
trauma and mental and emotional trauma

1723
01:10:04,630 --> 01:10:03,199
if they're there looking data mining and

1724
01:10:08,229 --> 01:10:04,640
looking for

1725
01:10:10,550 --> 01:10:08,239
more data to support whatever conclusion

1726
01:10:12,390 --> 01:10:10,560
i think that that you know there's a big

1727
01:10:15,510 --> 01:10:12,400
difference between being there to help

1728
01:10:17,510 --> 01:10:15,520
somebody and being there to uh to find

1729
01:10:20,310 --> 01:10:17,520
out information and

1730
01:10:21,750 --> 01:10:20,320
if your patient or your individual your

1731
01:10:22,870 --> 01:10:21,760
experiencer

1732
01:10:24,550 --> 01:10:22,880
isn't

1733
01:10:27,189 --> 01:10:24,560
their mental health and emotional health

1734
01:10:29,110 --> 01:10:27,199
isn't the number one priority

1735
01:10:31,830 --> 01:10:29,120
for the researcher

1736
01:10:33,189 --> 01:10:31,840
then they are in the wrong as far as i'm

1737
01:10:34,390 --> 01:10:33,199
concerned

1738
01:10:35,189 --> 01:10:34,400
and this is something that you don't

1739
01:10:36,870 --> 01:10:35,199
hear

1740
01:10:39,750 --> 01:10:36,880
people talk about very much is the

1741
01:10:42,470 --> 01:10:39,760
actual motivation for people like jacobs

1742
01:10:44,870 --> 01:10:42,480
or hopkins or yourself or leo if your

1743
01:10:46,550 --> 01:10:44,880
motivation has anything to do

1744
01:10:48,149 --> 01:10:46,560
with something other than helping

1745
01:10:51,590 --> 01:10:48,159
somebody get through a very very

1746
01:10:53,510 --> 01:10:51,600
emotional uh and traumatic uh series of

1747
01:10:56,470 --> 01:10:53,520
events or event then you're

1748
01:10:58,790 --> 01:10:56,480
you should be in another line of work

1749
01:11:02,390 --> 01:10:58,800
at least that's my opinion well you know

1750
01:11:05,750 --> 01:11:02,400
i agree with you on that because

1751
01:11:09,270 --> 01:11:05,760
the experiencer's emotional well-being

1752
01:11:11,590 --> 01:11:09,280
should be the number one priority

1753
01:11:14,149 --> 01:11:11,600
certainly you know a lot of

1754
01:11:16,229 --> 01:11:14,159
researchers many years ago particularly

1755
01:11:18,229 --> 01:11:16,239
were looking for information

1756
01:11:20,149 --> 01:11:18,239
and and a lot of people were harmed in

1757
01:11:20,870 --> 01:11:20,159
those days as well

1758
01:11:23,189 --> 01:11:20,880
but

1759
01:11:26,550 --> 01:11:23,199
we generally pretty much have that

1760
01:11:29,110 --> 01:11:26,560
information now you know as david jacobs

1761
01:11:31,350 --> 01:11:29,120
says and and he told me this

1762
01:11:33,270 --> 01:11:31,360
uh he doesn't know why he continues to

1763
01:11:34,950 --> 01:11:33,280
do it because everybody said tells him

1764
01:11:38,390 --> 01:11:34,960
the same story they're giving him the

1765
01:11:39,590 --> 01:11:38,400
same information over and over again

1766
01:11:44,630 --> 01:11:39,600
and

1767
01:11:45,990 --> 01:11:44,640
when you have uh hypnotized enough

1768
01:11:48,390 --> 01:11:46,000
individuals

1769
01:11:50,470 --> 01:11:48,400
that uh you know the information is

1770
01:11:51,830 --> 01:11:50,480
pretty much the same of course we have

1771
01:11:53,669 --> 01:11:51,840
to wonder here how much of that

1772
01:11:56,070 --> 01:11:53,679
information is accurate the other

1773
01:11:57,430 --> 01:11:56,080
question i have here is the sharing of

1774
01:12:00,149 --> 01:11:57,440
information

1775
01:12:02,070 --> 01:12:00,159
where one abductee talks to another and

1776
01:12:04,149 --> 01:12:02,080
david jacobs has these workshops where

1777
01:12:06,229 --> 01:12:04,159
abductees get together and share

1778
01:12:08,070 --> 01:12:06,239
experiences now

1779
01:12:09,510 --> 01:12:08,080
there are two questions here that occur

1780
01:12:12,149 --> 01:12:09,520
to me one is

1781
01:12:15,189 --> 01:12:12,159
is there a danger then of contaminating

1782
01:12:16,470 --> 01:12:15,199
someone else's recollection or

1783
01:12:18,149 --> 01:12:16,480
is it really

1784
01:12:21,110 --> 01:12:18,159
something that helps

1785
01:12:24,070 --> 01:12:21,120
in terms of allowing a person to maybe

1786
01:12:25,189 --> 01:12:24,080
feel better about what they're doing and

1787
01:12:27,350 --> 01:12:25,199
therefore

1788
01:12:29,990 --> 01:12:27,360
helps them but the other thing of course

1789
01:12:32,390 --> 01:12:30,000
is it's not like a jury where with a

1790
01:12:34,790 --> 01:12:32,400
jury you will tell them for a period of

1791
01:12:37,270 --> 01:12:34,800
time while the case is being considered

1792
01:12:39,430 --> 01:12:37,280
don't look to outside influences how do

1793
01:12:40,470 --> 01:12:39,440
you do that with abductees

1794
01:12:41,990 --> 01:12:40,480
well

1795
01:12:43,990 --> 01:12:42,000
it depends upon

1796
01:12:45,750 --> 01:12:44,000
your your motivation

1797
01:12:47,510 --> 01:12:45,760
in doing this

1798
01:13:11,270 --> 01:12:47,520
i

1799
01:13:14,310 --> 01:13:11,280
understand

1800
01:13:15,750 --> 01:13:14,320
and have experienced the same

1801
01:13:18,149 --> 01:13:15,760
kind of thing

1802
01:13:20,310 --> 01:13:18,159
but for the most part people are talking

1803
01:13:23,189 --> 01:13:20,320
about their emotions

1804
01:13:25,990 --> 01:13:23,199
their response to what has happened to

1805
01:13:28,390 --> 01:13:26,000
them and looking for support

1806
01:13:31,590 --> 01:13:28,400
certainly if you get into all of the

1807
01:13:32,630 --> 01:13:31,600
details of what has occurred

1808
01:13:37,669 --> 01:13:32,640
then

1809
01:13:40,070 --> 01:13:37,679
do an investigation on that person's

1810
01:13:42,470 --> 01:13:40,080
case you have two sides here you have

1811
01:13:45,110 --> 01:13:42,480
the investigative end

1812
01:13:46,550 --> 01:13:45,120
where you're looking for evidence

1813
01:13:49,750 --> 01:13:46,560
and you have

1814
01:13:50,950 --> 01:13:49,760
the other side where individuals need

1815
01:13:53,669 --> 01:13:50,960
support

1816
01:13:54,870 --> 01:13:53,679
you should have collected that evidence

1817
01:13:57,510 --> 01:13:54,880
first

1818
01:13:58,830 --> 01:13:57,520
and that's what we do at mufon when we

1819
01:14:00,470 --> 01:13:58,840
when we do an

1820
01:14:02,149 --> 01:14:00,480
investigation

1821
01:14:05,350 --> 01:14:02,159
people contact

1822
01:14:08,470 --> 01:14:05,360
the experiencer research team which is

1823
01:14:10,310 --> 01:14:08,480
sort of like a triage unit i'm i'm

1824
01:14:11,430 --> 01:14:10,320
mufon's director of experience or

1825
01:14:12,630 --> 01:14:11,440
research

1826
01:14:14,709 --> 01:14:12,640
and

1827
01:14:17,990 --> 01:14:14,719
the people on my team speak with these

1828
01:14:19,990 --> 01:14:18,000
individuals they've already taken

1829
01:14:23,110 --> 01:14:20,000
a questionnaire to determine what they

1830
01:14:25,430 --> 01:14:23,120
have in common with other experiencers

1831
01:14:27,750 --> 01:14:25,440
so it's a two-step process here first

1832
01:14:29,350 --> 01:14:27,760
learn what's going on and then after you

1833
01:14:31,510 --> 01:14:29,360
get the information that you feel you

1834
01:14:34,149 --> 01:14:31,520
can get then maybe it's appropriate for

1835
01:14:37,270 --> 01:14:34,159
them to commiserate with each other yes

1836
01:14:38,709 --> 01:14:37,280
well we act as a triage team where

1837
01:14:40,630 --> 01:14:38,719
uh we

1838
01:14:42,709 --> 01:14:40,640
help people to determine what is the

1839
01:14:45,189 --> 01:14:42,719
best route for them to take

1840
01:14:46,229 --> 01:14:45,199
do they have evidence do they want to

1841
01:14:47,030 --> 01:14:46,239
have

1842
01:14:49,510 --> 01:14:47,040
an

1843
01:14:52,070 --> 01:14:49,520
investigation of their case or are they

1844
01:14:53,990 --> 01:14:52,080
merely looking for support

1845
01:14:57,030 --> 01:14:54,000
and so people

1846
01:14:59,750 --> 01:14:57,040
are able to choose what they want but if

1847
01:15:01,110 --> 01:14:59,760
they're already going to a support group

1848
01:15:03,430 --> 01:15:01,120
and they have done that for a long

1849
01:15:06,709 --> 01:15:03,440
period of time then certainly we can't

1850
01:15:12,310 --> 01:15:08,950
an investigation of their case because

1851
01:15:14,390 --> 01:15:12,320
their information might be contaminated

1852
01:15:15,310 --> 01:15:14,400
but something that i do do when i work

1853
01:15:18,790 --> 01:15:15,320
with

1854
01:15:21,669 --> 01:15:18,800
experiences in the workshops that i give

1855
01:15:23,750 --> 01:15:21,679
is to teach them how to collect their

1856
01:15:25,030 --> 01:15:23,760
evidence in order to determine for

1857
01:15:28,630 --> 01:15:25,040
themselves

1858
01:15:31,350 --> 01:15:28,640
if this is real and you know there

1859
01:15:34,310 --> 01:15:31,360
there are probably thousands of people

1860
01:15:37,590 --> 01:15:34,320
or maybe millions of people who believe

1861
01:15:38,390 --> 01:15:37,600
they've had these experiences

1862
01:15:41,270 --> 01:15:38,400
uh

1863
01:15:44,149 --> 01:15:41,280
you know so so it's very difficult but

1864
01:15:46,310 --> 01:15:44,159
this the starting point is

1865
01:15:49,510 --> 01:15:46,320
to look for evidence

1866
01:15:52,470 --> 01:15:49,520
uh you know is is this just a dream is

1867
01:15:54,630 --> 01:15:52,480
this uh a hypnagogic hypnopomic

1868
01:15:56,870 --> 01:15:54,640
hallucination or

1869
01:15:58,390 --> 01:15:56,880
is this something that is real it's is

1870
01:16:01,030 --> 01:15:58,400
it something that it's a

1871
01:16:03,030 --> 01:16:01,040
is occurring over and over again have

1872
01:16:04,790 --> 01:16:03,040
you found fluorescence on your skin do

1873
01:16:06,630 --> 01:16:04,800
you have specific

1874
01:16:08,870 --> 01:16:06,640
types of

1875
01:16:11,030 --> 01:16:08,880
marks on your skin that you can

1876
01:16:14,709 --> 01:16:11,040
photograph and send to members of our

1877
01:16:16,470 --> 01:16:14,719
team to look at to help you determine

1878
01:16:18,950 --> 01:16:16,480
whether or not

1879
01:16:20,390 --> 01:16:18,960
your markings are consistent with the

1880
01:16:23,030 --> 01:16:20,400
markings that we see

1881
01:16:25,270 --> 01:16:23,040
on other experiences and you have

1882
01:16:26,870 --> 01:16:25,280
conscious continuous recall

1883
01:16:29,030 --> 01:16:26,880
we have questions coming from our

1884
01:16:31,350 --> 01:16:29,040
listeners too of kathleen martin more to

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come with gene and chris you're in the

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you are listening to gcn

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1958
01:19:20,950 --> 01:19:19,440
800-261-0937 did you know that home

1959
01:19:23,030 --> 01:19:20,960
break-ins increased more than 100

1960
01:19:25,030 --> 01:19:23,040
percent during the holidays it takes

1961
01:19:27,189 --> 01:19:25,040
just 10 seconds for an intruder to kick

1962
01:19:29,189 --> 01:19:27,199
in your door but police response to a

1963
01:19:31,270 --> 01:19:29,199
home alarm system is more than 20

1964
01:19:33,590 --> 01:19:31,280
minutes and intruders are in and out of

1965
01:19:35,270 --> 01:19:33,600
your home in five minutes thieves know

1966
01:19:37,910 --> 01:19:35,280
that you're not home and have presence

1967
01:19:40,550 --> 01:19:37,920
inside just waiting to be taken and if

1968
01:19:42,390 --> 01:19:40,560
you are home how safe will you feel with

1969
01:19:44,550 --> 01:19:42,400
an intruder lurking inside with your

1970
01:19:46,790 --> 01:19:44,560
family that's why police across the

1971
01:19:49,030 --> 01:19:46,800
country are recommending you use door

1972
01:19:51,910 --> 01:19:49,040
armor proven to withstand the force of a

1973
01:19:54,149 --> 01:19:51,920
battering ram door armor keeps intruders

1974
01:19:56,229 --> 01:19:54,159
out it's easy to install and barely

1975
01:19:57,990 --> 01:19:56,239
visible and your door armor is

1976
01:19:59,669 --> 01:19:58,000
guaranteed for life go to

1977
01:20:02,149 --> 01:19:59,679
invasionstopper.com

1978
01:20:04,550 --> 01:20:02,159
for a very special buy one get one at

1979
01:20:06,950 --> 01:20:04,560
half off deal these savings are for a

1980
01:20:09,189 --> 01:20:06,960
limited time and only available to gcn

1981
01:20:12,270 --> 01:20:09,199
listeners protect your valuables and

1982
01:20:14,390 --> 01:20:12,280
loved ones this holiday season go to

1983
01:20:18,709 --> 01:20:14,400
invasionstopper.com now that's

1984
01:20:22,070 --> 01:20:20,229
this is dan pillow do you have the irs

1985
01:20:23,910 --> 01:20:22,080
money you can't pay are tax debts

1986
01:20:26,310 --> 01:20:23,920
crippling you i've defended people from

1987
01:20:28,390 --> 01:20:26,320
the irs for over 30 years i've helped

1988
01:20:29,830 --> 01:20:28,400
thousands and i can help you too i wrote

1989
01:20:31,510 --> 01:20:29,840
the book on irs settlement and i'm

1990
01:20:35,189 --> 01:20:31,520
telling you there's no such thing as a

1991
01:20:37,430 --> 01:20:35,199
hopeless case call 834 no tax to finally

1992
01:20:38,950 --> 01:20:37,440
get free of irs debt with the irs's new

1993
01:20:41,830 --> 01:20:38,960
programs there's never been a better

1994
01:20:45,590 --> 01:20:41,840
time to solve your problem call 834 no

1995
01:20:49,780 --> 01:20:45,600
tax that's 800 34 no tax or my website

1996
01:20:55,990 --> 01:20:54,630
[Music]

1997
01:20:57,590 --> 01:20:56,000
this is micah hanks of the greatly

1998
01:20:59,830 --> 01:20:57,600
report and you're listening to the

1999
01:21:00,700 --> 01:20:59,840
paracast the gold standard of paranormal

2000
01:21:08,950 --> 01:21:00,710
radio

2001
01:21:11,590 --> 01:21:08,960
[Music]

2002
01:21:14,470 --> 01:21:11,600
kathleen martin abduction investigator

2003
01:21:17,350 --> 01:21:14,480
for mufon joining us on the power cast

2004
01:21:20,870 --> 01:21:17,360
this week so kathleen is there a formal

2005
01:21:22,630 --> 01:21:20,880
set of guidelines for would-be abduction

2006
01:21:23,510 --> 01:21:22,640
researchers who want to get involved in

2007
01:21:25,990 --> 01:21:23,520
this

2008
01:21:27,350 --> 01:21:26,000
we have not written a formal set of

2009
01:21:29,189 --> 01:21:27,360
guidelines

2010
01:21:33,590 --> 01:21:29,199
for researchers who

2011
01:21:35,590 --> 01:21:33,600
want to get involved in et contact cases

2012
01:21:39,110 --> 01:21:35,600
it takes many years

2013
01:21:41,830 --> 01:21:39,120
of training in the mutual ufo network

2014
01:21:43,350 --> 01:21:41,840
in order to be on my team

2015
01:21:46,630 --> 01:21:43,360
i require

2016
01:21:48,950 --> 01:21:46,640
individuals to have a great deal of

2017
01:21:51,470 --> 01:21:48,960
knowledge have done a great deal of

2018
01:21:54,830 --> 01:21:51,480
reading some members of my team are

2019
01:21:57,270 --> 01:21:54,840
experiencers some members of my team are

2020
01:21:59,990 --> 01:21:57,280
hypnotherapists but they're not working

2021
01:22:00,950 --> 01:22:00,000
with the individuals that we talk to

2022
01:22:02,390 --> 01:22:00,960
also

2023
01:22:05,110 --> 01:22:02,400
they have to be

2024
01:22:07,590 --> 01:22:05,120
experienced mufon field investigators

2025
01:22:09,510 --> 01:22:07,600
which means that they have to undergo

2026
01:22:10,390 --> 01:22:09,520
extensive training

2027
01:22:11,350 --> 01:22:10,400
and

2028
01:22:13,189 --> 01:22:11,360
in

2029
01:22:16,470 --> 01:22:13,199
addition to

2030
01:22:18,790 --> 01:22:16,480
this training they've had to undergo a

2031
01:22:21,750 --> 01:22:18,800
background security check

2032
01:22:24,470 --> 01:22:21,760
i want to know that individuals have

2033
01:22:27,750 --> 01:22:24,480
caring for under other individuals and

2034
01:22:30,470 --> 01:22:27,760
some knowledge of psychology as well we

2035
01:22:33,350 --> 01:22:30,480
have a retired psychotherapist on our

2036
01:22:35,189 --> 01:22:33,360
team we have a retired medical doctor

2037
01:22:36,830 --> 01:22:35,199
we have two

2038
01:22:38,629 --> 01:22:36,840
practicing

2039
01:22:42,390 --> 01:22:38,639
hypnotherapists

2040
01:22:44,709 --> 01:22:42,400
uh we have other individuals who are

2041
01:22:46,870 --> 01:22:44,719
kind caring individuals who are

2042
01:22:48,790 --> 01:22:46,880
knowledgeable about this field

2043
01:22:50,950 --> 01:22:48,800
chris we have some listener questions we

2044
01:22:52,629 --> 01:22:50,960
should get to now would you start with

2045
01:22:54,709 --> 01:22:52,639
us please since we're talking about

2046
01:22:57,270 --> 01:22:54,719
experiencer groups this is a question

2047
01:22:59,470 --> 01:22:57,280
from mulvaney who's been a poster since

2048
01:23:01,430 --> 01:22:59,480
2012 at

2049
01:23:03,030 --> 01:23:01,440
forum.theparacast.com where in our

2050
01:23:04,629 --> 01:23:03,040
question bank our listeners are able to

2051
01:23:07,030 --> 01:23:04,639
ask our guests

2052
01:23:09,590 --> 01:23:07,040
their particular questions and this is a

2053
01:23:11,590 --> 01:23:09,600
good one i have heard this uh from

2054
01:23:12,390 --> 01:23:11,600
individuals that if you have an interest

2055
01:23:15,990 --> 01:23:12,400
in

2056
01:23:17,990 --> 01:23:16,000
abductee and that's what mulvaney wants

2057
01:23:20,149 --> 01:23:18,000
to know do you believe

2058
01:23:22,070 --> 01:23:20,159
as has been said at some experiencer

2059
01:23:23,430 --> 01:23:22,080
groups that interest in the phenomenon

2060
01:23:24,470 --> 01:23:23,440
may well indicate you have hidden

2061
01:23:26,790 --> 01:23:24,480
memories

2062
01:23:29,110 --> 01:23:26,800
i don't agree with that

2063
01:23:30,870 --> 01:23:29,120
people can be very interested in in a

2064
01:23:35,030 --> 01:23:30,880
number of different things it doesn't

2065
01:23:36,390 --> 01:23:35,040
mean that they have participated in that

2066
01:23:38,709 --> 01:23:36,400
experience

2067
01:23:41,430 --> 01:23:38,719
however there are people who seem

2068
01:23:44,070 --> 01:23:41,440
obsessed with this

2069
01:23:46,790 --> 01:23:44,080
and those people who have this kind of

2070
01:23:48,390 --> 01:23:46,800
obsession this nagging obsession these

2071
01:23:51,750 --> 01:23:48,400
recurring dreams

2072
01:23:53,750 --> 01:23:51,760
maybe multiple ufo sightings

2073
01:23:55,830 --> 01:23:53,760
i i would say there's a probably a

2074
01:23:57,830 --> 01:23:55,840
pretty good chance that they've had

2075
01:23:59,669 --> 01:23:57,840
their own experiences

2076
01:24:01,430 --> 01:23:59,679
this one comes from

2077
01:24:03,430 --> 01:24:01,440
our good friend randall up in calgary

2078
01:24:04,229 --> 01:24:03,440
alberta ufology

2079
01:24:06,910 --> 01:24:04,239
who

2080
01:24:09,350 --> 01:24:06,920
has just recently passed the

2081
01:24:11,830 --> 01:24:09,360
6300 postmark

2082
01:24:15,030 --> 01:24:11,840
he does not get a free apple watch i'm

2083
01:24:19,750 --> 01:24:17,910
okay randall's one of our more

2084
01:24:22,229 --> 01:24:19,760
hard-boiled um

2085
01:24:24,550 --> 01:24:22,239
realists about all this and uh he's

2086
01:24:25,990 --> 01:24:24,560
convinced that it's all real but uh to

2087
01:24:28,070 --> 01:24:26,000
what degree

2088
01:24:30,070 --> 01:24:28,080
is still open in his mind and his

2089
01:24:32,229 --> 01:24:30,080
question is i'm assuming that you

2090
01:24:35,030 --> 01:24:32,239
believe alien abduction is objectively

2091
01:24:37,270 --> 01:24:35,040
real and not merely some psychological

2092
01:24:38,950 --> 01:24:37,280
manifestation if that assumption is

2093
01:24:40,870 --> 01:24:38,960
incorrect please elaborate on your

2094
01:24:43,430 --> 01:24:40,880
actual position otherwise

2095
01:24:45,270 --> 01:24:43,440
what specific key examples of physical

2096
01:24:47,910 --> 01:24:45,280
evidence in your research has impressed

2097
01:24:50,149 --> 01:24:47,920
you the most and led you to believe that

2098
01:24:51,350 --> 01:24:50,159
this is all real and he goes on to say

2099
01:24:53,030 --> 01:24:51,360
i'm not aware of any direct or

2100
01:24:55,110 --> 01:24:53,040
relatively objective evidence in the

2101
01:24:57,910 --> 01:24:55,120
abduction field something equivalent to

2102
01:24:59,270 --> 01:24:57,920
a radar track he says alleged implants

2103
01:25:00,470 --> 01:24:59,280
aren't direct evidence neither is

2104
01:25:01,990 --> 01:25:00,480
hypnosis

2105
01:25:04,950 --> 01:25:02,000
assisted recall

2106
01:25:06,229 --> 01:25:04,960
neither drawings like star maps are

2107
01:25:08,390 --> 01:25:06,239
or not

2108
01:25:10,310 --> 01:25:08,400
um neither is alleged trace evidence

2109
01:25:12,470 --> 01:25:10,320
although i disagree with that one

2110
01:25:16,149 --> 01:25:12,480
is there anything that he's missing

2111
01:25:18,550 --> 01:25:16,159
i disagree with some of what he has said

2112
01:25:19,430 --> 01:25:18,560
yeah me too the case that

2113
01:25:21,990 --> 01:25:19,440
uh

2114
01:25:25,030 --> 01:25:22,000
was most impressive to me was that of

2115
01:25:27,510 --> 01:25:25,040
betty and barney hill and of course that

2116
01:25:28,629 --> 01:25:27,520
i'm their niece i was 13 when it

2117
01:25:29,750 --> 01:25:28,639
occurred

2118
01:25:31,030 --> 01:25:29,760
i

2119
01:25:31,830 --> 01:25:31,040
was there

2120
01:25:54,470 --> 01:25:31,840
i

2121
01:25:57,510 --> 01:25:54,480
dress for example

2122
01:25:59,990 --> 01:25:57,520
when she returned home

2123
01:26:02,390 --> 01:26:00,000
after having worn it

2124
01:26:05,110 --> 01:26:02,400
just riding in the car it was her

2125
01:26:05,990 --> 01:26:05,120
favorite dress she she hadn't worn it

2126
01:26:07,830 --> 01:26:06,000
very

2127
01:26:11,350 --> 01:26:07,840
much but

2128
01:26:13,030 --> 01:26:11,360
when she returned and she took it off

2129
01:26:16,790 --> 01:26:13,040
that morning

2130
01:26:19,830 --> 01:26:16,800
it was torn from waste to hemline the

2131
01:26:21,270 --> 01:26:19,840
the lining was the hem was torn down on

2132
01:26:22,470 --> 01:26:21,280
one side

2133
01:26:25,669 --> 01:26:22,480
there was

2134
01:26:28,149 --> 01:26:25,679
a big tear a two inch tear in the

2135
01:26:31,189 --> 01:26:28,159
stitching at the top of the zipper and

2136
01:26:35,270 --> 01:26:31,199
the thick zipper fabric had a one inch

2137
01:26:37,030 --> 01:26:35,280
tear in it how did that occur

2138
01:26:39,669 --> 01:26:37,040
i think that's pretty good evidence

2139
01:26:42,229 --> 01:26:39,679
considering i i've totally forgotten

2140
01:26:44,790 --> 01:26:42,239
that detail you mean the actual zipper

2141
01:26:47,350 --> 01:26:44,800
the fabric around the zipper was torn

2142
01:26:50,550 --> 01:26:47,360
yes absolutely i totally forgot about

2143
01:26:53,110 --> 01:26:50,560
that hasn't been brought out all of the

2144
01:26:55,910 --> 01:26:53,120
focus has been upon pink powder that

2145
01:26:58,310 --> 01:26:55,920
grew on that dress after she put it into

2146
01:27:01,110 --> 01:26:58,320
her closet but there was very good

2147
01:27:03,590 --> 01:27:01,120
forensic evidence there that something

2148
01:27:05,830 --> 01:27:03,600
happened to betty and betty and barney

2149
01:27:08,390 --> 01:27:05,840
had conscious continuous recall of a

2150
01:27:10,790 --> 01:27:08,400
close encounter with the ufo it

2151
01:27:13,430 --> 01:27:10,800
interacted with them by

2152
01:27:16,629 --> 01:27:13,440
causing code-like buzzing sounds on the

2153
01:27:20,149 --> 01:27:16,639
trunk of that vehicle the next day they

2154
01:27:22,550 --> 01:27:20,159
found shiny spots that caused a compass

2155
01:27:25,189 --> 01:27:22,560
needle to spin and spin meaning there

2156
01:27:27,830 --> 01:27:25,199
was a magnetic field around the trunk of

2157
01:27:30,790 --> 01:27:27,840
that car and we have seen that in other

2158
01:27:33,590 --> 01:27:30,800
cases that we have investigated at mufon

2159
01:27:37,270 --> 01:27:33,600
the the most familiar one is probably

2160
01:27:39,430 --> 01:27:37,280
the the matthew reed case of 2009

2161
01:27:41,270 --> 01:27:39,440
where although the spots weren't there

2162
01:27:43,430 --> 01:27:41,280
there was a magnetic field around the

2163
01:27:45,510 --> 01:27:43,440
trunk of his car

2164
01:27:48,070 --> 01:27:45,520
we have to we have to look at that

2165
01:27:50,070 --> 01:27:48,080
evidence and it isn't one piece of

2166
01:27:52,870 --> 01:27:50,080
evidence the debunkers the skeptics

2167
01:27:55,110 --> 01:27:52,880
always say show me the smoking gun show

2168
01:27:57,189 --> 01:27:55,120
me the one piece of evidence it isn't

2169
01:27:59,669 --> 01:27:57,199
one piece of evidence it is the

2170
01:28:02,950 --> 01:27:59,679
preponderance of evidence

2171
01:28:05,590 --> 01:28:02,960
the collection of evidence that you have

2172
01:28:09,669 --> 01:28:05,600
and this repeating evidence that you see

2173
01:28:11,669 --> 01:28:09,679
over and over again in these cases you

2174
01:28:13,510 --> 01:28:11,679
have to look at the credibility of the

2175
01:28:15,910 --> 01:28:13,520
witnesses you have to look at the

2176
01:28:18,310 --> 01:28:15,920
physical evidence the tops of barney's

2177
01:28:19,430 --> 01:28:18,320
best dressed shoes were so deeply

2178
01:28:22,550 --> 01:28:19,440
scraped

2179
01:28:26,229 --> 01:28:22,560
that he had to purchase new shoes

2180
01:28:29,430 --> 01:28:26,239
after the event that occurred that night

2181
01:28:30,709 --> 01:28:29,440
there are other things betty recalled uh

2182
01:28:34,229 --> 01:28:30,719
observing

2183
01:28:36,149 --> 01:28:34,239
symbols on that craft she i asked her to

2184
01:28:38,229 --> 01:28:36,159
sketch those symbols for me in the year

2185
01:28:40,629 --> 01:28:38,239
2000 and she did

2186
01:28:43,189 --> 01:28:40,639
took her a while to a couple of weeks to

2187
01:28:44,870 --> 01:28:43,199
to remember them but she sketched a few

2188
01:28:48,870 --> 01:28:44,880
that she remembered and they were

2189
01:28:50,790 --> 01:28:48,880
published in um my book was stanton

2190
01:28:53,510 --> 01:28:50,800
friedman captured the betty and barney

2191
01:28:57,350 --> 01:28:53,520
hill ufo experience

2192
01:28:58,709 --> 01:28:57,360
well don c dondery a professor at mcgill

2193
01:29:00,470 --> 01:28:58,719
university

2194
01:29:03,629 --> 01:29:00,480
psychology professor

2195
01:29:06,550 --> 01:29:03,639
was doing a study had done a study in

2196
01:29:08,470 --> 01:29:06,560
2004. no one had ever seen betty's

2197
01:29:11,030 --> 01:29:08,480
symbols because i kept them in my file

2198
01:29:13,430 --> 01:29:11,040
cabinet and hadn't shown them to anybody

2199
01:29:15,270 --> 01:29:13,440
when dunn's study was done he worked

2200
01:29:17,510 --> 01:29:15,280
with stewart appel from the state

2201
01:29:19,669 --> 01:29:17,520
university of new york and with bud

2202
01:29:22,310 --> 01:29:19,679
hopkins and

2203
01:29:25,590 --> 01:29:22,320
they had three different groups they had

2204
01:29:28,709 --> 01:29:25,600
buds experiencers who had

2205
01:29:33,430 --> 01:29:28,719
sketch symbols under hypnosis and of

2206
01:29:38,950 --> 01:29:36,229
also they had graduate students

2207
01:29:41,990 --> 01:29:38,960
and two groups of graduate students one

2208
01:29:44,470 --> 01:29:42,000
who were hypnotized and and

2209
01:29:45,910 --> 01:29:44,480
made to imagine that they saw

2210
01:29:48,709 --> 01:29:45,920
symbols on a craft and they should

2211
01:29:51,430 --> 01:29:48,719
sketch them also a group of graduate

2212
01:29:54,229 --> 01:29:51,440
school students who simply sketch

2213
01:29:57,910 --> 01:29:54,239
symbols that they thought might be seen

2214
01:30:00,229 --> 01:29:57,920
on an alien craft and then all of these

2215
01:30:02,790 --> 01:30:00,239
symbols that were collected were

2216
01:30:04,790 --> 01:30:02,800
photocopied on the same paper and

2217
01:30:06,629 --> 01:30:04,800
presented to a group of graduate

2218
01:30:08,070 --> 01:30:06,639
students who did

2219
01:30:10,229 --> 01:30:08,080
an analysis

2220
01:30:13,830 --> 01:30:10,239
on them looking for similarities and

2221
01:30:15,030 --> 01:30:13,840
differences and in the end

2222
01:30:17,990 --> 01:30:15,040
those

2223
01:30:20,790 --> 01:30:18,000
experiencers in bud hopkins group had

2224
01:30:23,510 --> 01:30:20,800
symbols that were very very similar but

2225
01:30:24,950 --> 01:30:23,520
were very different from the other two

2226
01:30:27,750 --> 01:30:24,960
groups from the groups of graduate

2227
01:30:29,990 --> 01:30:27,760
students let's cover this further in our

2228
01:30:38,700 --> 01:30:30,000
next segment with kathleen martin and

2229
01:30:43,270 --> 01:30:39,830
[Applause]

2230
01:30:44,590 --> 01:30:43,280
thank you for listening to gcn

2231
01:30:47,350 --> 01:30:44,600
be sure to visit

2232
01:30:49,189 --> 01:30:47,360
gcnlive.com today

2233
01:30:51,590 --> 01:30:49,199
graphic converter is the image

2234
01:30:54,470 --> 01:30:51,600
manipulation tool for the rest of us it

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the images of a folder drag it into

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graphic inverter and a powerful browser

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opens up to show your image files you

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could use it for slideshows you could

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use it to import images from digital

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cameras or from scanners need to do some

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graphic inverter also print catalogs

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coach using a common sense osteopath

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2334
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hi it's grant cameron from presidential

2335
01:35:01,030 --> 01:34:58,800
ufo.com

2336
01:35:08,790 --> 01:35:01,040
you're listening to the pericast

2337
01:35:13,669 --> 01:35:11,430
so kathleen martin was explaining more

2338
01:35:15,750 --> 01:35:13,679
information about these test results

2339
01:35:18,709 --> 01:35:15,760
would you continue please i certainly

2340
01:35:19,990 --> 01:35:18,719
will the team of researchers

2341
01:35:22,149 --> 01:35:20,000
announced

2342
01:35:23,510 --> 01:35:22,159
that the similarity

2343
01:35:26,390 --> 01:35:23,520
of symbols

2344
01:35:27,669 --> 01:35:26,400
among these experiencers

2345
01:35:31,430 --> 01:35:27,679
suggests

2346
01:35:35,350 --> 01:35:31,440
that alien abduction might be real and

2347
01:35:38,390 --> 01:35:35,360
what i was stating is that don don jerry

2348
01:35:40,229 --> 01:35:38,400
saw those symbols in my book for the

2349
01:35:42,310 --> 01:35:40,239
first time when it was published in

2350
01:35:45,110 --> 01:35:42,320
2007.

2351
01:35:47,910 --> 01:35:45,120
and he did a comparative analysis of

2352
01:35:51,750 --> 01:35:47,920
those against the symbols that he had

2353
01:35:54,070 --> 01:35:51,760
collected in his study and he found that

2354
01:35:55,910 --> 01:35:54,080
many of betty's symbols

2355
01:35:59,350 --> 01:35:55,920
matched the symbols that the

2356
01:36:01,590 --> 01:35:59,360
experiencers in his study had drawn so i

2357
01:36:04,470 --> 01:36:01,600
thought that that was another

2358
01:36:07,830 --> 01:36:04,480
piece of scientific evidence

2359
01:36:10,229 --> 01:36:07,840
that this was a real event i'm not going

2360
01:36:13,110 --> 01:36:10,239
to say the star map was i've always had

2361
01:36:15,830 --> 01:36:13,120
questions about the starmap but when it

2362
01:36:18,709 --> 01:36:15,840
comes down to this kind of evidence

2363
01:36:21,430 --> 01:36:18,719
whether it's part of an academic study

2364
01:36:23,910 --> 01:36:21,440
or whether it's actual physical or

2365
01:36:26,070 --> 01:36:23,920
circumstantial evidence i think it's

2366
01:36:27,910 --> 01:36:26,080
important well speaking of physical

2367
01:36:31,350 --> 01:36:27,920
evidence we've got a good question from

2368
01:36:33,110 --> 01:36:31,360
vamana and this uh particular aspect of

2369
01:36:35,910 --> 01:36:33,120
research and investigation within the

2370
01:36:37,990 --> 01:36:35,920
abduction field brought out a little bit

2371
01:36:40,629 --> 01:36:38,000
of attention i think in our our talk

2372
01:36:43,189 --> 01:36:40,639
with uh with david jacobs and that is

2373
01:36:45,350 --> 01:36:43,199
the idea of actually

2374
01:36:47,350 --> 01:36:45,360
wiring up an abductee's house actually

2375
01:36:49,350 --> 01:36:47,360
this is a question from technomanche

2376
01:36:51,510 --> 01:36:49,360
instead of solely performing hypnotic

2377
01:36:53,510 --> 01:36:51,520
regression have you tried to wire up an

2378
01:36:55,189 --> 01:36:53,520
abductee's house with their permission

2379
01:36:57,189 --> 01:36:55,199
to obtain evidence of the aliens

2380
01:36:58,790 --> 01:36:57,199
existence in other words you know now

2381
01:37:00,870 --> 01:36:58,800
that we have this level of technology

2382
01:37:04,830 --> 01:37:00,880
and the price point coming down

2383
01:37:07,030 --> 01:37:04,840
on uh you know 4k 16k cameras that can

2384
01:37:07,990 --> 01:37:07,040
be hidden

2385
01:37:10,229 --> 01:37:08,000
in

2386
01:37:12,229 --> 01:37:10,239
the most unobtrusive places or

2387
01:37:14,870 --> 01:37:12,239
unobtrusive places

2388
01:37:16,629 --> 01:37:14,880
what is your position on attempting to

2389
01:37:18,470 --> 01:37:16,639
be proactive

2390
01:37:21,430 --> 01:37:18,480
and attempting to

2391
01:37:24,149 --> 01:37:21,440
document some of these types of alleged

2392
01:37:26,310 --> 01:37:24,159
experiences they tend to happen fairly

2393
01:37:29,350 --> 01:37:26,320
frequently with some people what is the

2394
01:37:30,629 --> 01:37:29,360
state of actual physical surveillance of

2395
01:37:33,750 --> 01:37:30,639
potential

2396
01:37:36,709 --> 01:37:33,760
abductees we are doing that and there

2397
01:37:39,669 --> 01:37:36,719
are several experiencers that i have

2398
01:37:40,950 --> 01:37:39,679
been working with who have purchased the

2399
01:37:43,750 --> 01:37:40,960
equipment

2400
01:37:45,510 --> 01:37:43,760
and have it set up in their homes i have

2401
01:37:47,590 --> 01:37:45,520
received film

2402
01:37:49,510 --> 01:37:47,600
from two individuals

2403
01:37:52,790 --> 01:37:49,520
and what it shows

2404
01:37:54,870 --> 01:37:52,800
is these individuals they seem to be

2405
01:37:56,550 --> 01:37:54,880
awake sitting up

2406
01:37:59,750 --> 01:37:56,560
hyper vigilant

2407
01:38:01,030 --> 01:37:59,760
on the film and then all of a sudden it

2408
01:38:04,870 --> 01:38:01,040
shuts down

2409
01:38:07,109 --> 01:38:04,880
and then what you see is two hours or a

2410
01:38:08,470 --> 01:38:07,119
little more passes

2411
01:38:11,189 --> 01:38:08,480
there is no

2412
01:38:13,270 --> 01:38:11,199
movement there's nothing on the film and

2413
01:38:14,470 --> 01:38:13,280
then all of a sudden

2414
01:38:16,950 --> 01:38:14,480
there they are

2415
01:38:19,510 --> 01:38:16,960
in bed in a different position

2416
01:38:22,629 --> 01:38:19,520
so it seems that the cameras are

2417
01:38:24,550 --> 01:38:22,639
shutting down i have another film that i

2418
01:38:27,750 --> 01:38:24,560
received from an experiencer that i've

2419
01:38:30,790 --> 01:38:27,760
been working with who is able to capture

2420
01:38:33,430 --> 01:38:30,800
a light orb that seemed to be shooting

2421
01:38:36,310 --> 01:38:33,440
up out of his floor

2422
01:38:39,910 --> 01:38:36,320
and went across the room

2423
01:38:42,229 --> 01:38:39,920
stopped and dove down into his body and

2424
01:38:44,790 --> 01:38:42,239
then you saw it a little later that it

2425
01:38:47,990 --> 01:38:44,800
was more like a dust orb or something

2426
01:38:50,310 --> 01:38:48,000
but it just shot up it was not the solid

2427
01:38:53,510 --> 01:38:50,320
kind of illuminated ball that entered

2428
01:38:55,590 --> 01:38:53,520
his body it's very perplexing i've been

2429
01:38:57,030 --> 01:38:55,600
able to collect a little bit of this

2430
01:38:59,430 --> 01:38:57,040
type of evidence

2431
01:39:00,790 --> 01:38:59,440
based on your years of experience do you

2432
01:39:03,430 --> 01:39:00,800
think that this is

2433
01:39:04,310 --> 01:39:03,440
a potentially productive way of going

2434
01:39:06,629 --> 01:39:04,320
about

2435
01:39:08,950 --> 01:39:06,639
monitoring these folks having maybe

2436
01:39:11,430 --> 01:39:08,960
redundant systems set up systems set up

2437
01:39:13,830 --> 01:39:11,440
outside that may be able to

2438
01:39:16,070 --> 01:39:13,840
document the entire scene i can

2439
01:39:18,229 --> 01:39:16,080
understand based on

2440
01:39:20,229 --> 01:39:18,239
several attempts that i've

2441
01:39:21,189 --> 01:39:20,239
made in the past and of course the

2442
01:39:22,870 --> 01:39:21,199
famous

2443
01:39:24,870 --> 01:39:22,880
incident of the camera filming the

2444
01:39:27,109 --> 01:39:24,880
camera on the skinwalker ranch in utah

2445
01:39:28,709 --> 01:39:27,119
and having all the wires torn out while

2446
01:39:31,109 --> 01:39:28,719
the other camera was filming the camera

2447
01:39:34,229 --> 01:39:31,119
that was that was attacked and nothing's

2448
01:39:36,310 --> 01:39:34,239
showing up to me you have a set of data

2449
01:39:39,430 --> 01:39:36,320
if you have a continual

2450
01:39:42,629 --> 01:39:39,440
turning off of gear or gear failing in

2451
01:39:45,830 --> 01:39:42,639
some way if this happens in a continuous

2452
01:39:46,950 --> 01:39:45,840
pattern showing evidence of data or lack

2453
01:39:51,030 --> 01:39:46,960
of data

2454
01:39:53,350 --> 01:39:51,040
me so is this something that that's a

2455
01:39:56,390 --> 01:39:53,360
priority for you guys i mean dang the

2456
01:39:59,270 --> 01:39:56,400
technology is is really affordable now

2457
01:40:01,830 --> 01:39:59,280
you know it is a priority for me

2458
01:40:04,070 --> 01:40:01,840
i'm into collecting evidence and i feel

2459
01:40:06,709 --> 01:40:04,080
that it's extremely important to collect

2460
01:40:09,910 --> 01:40:06,719
evidence not just stories not just

2461
01:40:12,070 --> 01:40:09,920
correlating information and so

2462
01:40:15,109 --> 01:40:12,080
you know i think it is very important i

2463
01:40:17,189 --> 01:40:15,119
only wish that we had a benefactor

2464
01:40:20,310 --> 01:40:17,199
because i believe that if we had an

2465
01:40:23,350 --> 01:40:20,320
extremely wealthy benefactor or on more

2466
01:40:26,310 --> 01:40:23,360
than one or even if the government would

2467
01:40:29,270 --> 01:40:26,320
show an interest in this and fund some

2468
01:40:32,470 --> 01:40:29,280
kind of project i think that we would be

2469
01:40:33,590 --> 01:40:32,480
able to collect a large amount of

2470
01:40:36,950 --> 01:40:33,600
evidence

2471
01:40:38,709 --> 01:40:36,960
if individuals who have undergone these

2472
01:40:40,229 --> 01:40:38,719
experiences

2473
01:40:45,590 --> 01:40:40,239
could undergo

2474
01:40:47,109 --> 01:40:45,600
x-rays or mris or cat scans if

2475
01:40:50,550 --> 01:40:47,119
they could undergo

2476
01:40:53,350 --> 01:40:50,560
a lot of medical testing immediately

2477
01:40:56,470 --> 01:40:53,360
then we would be able to acquire more

2478
01:40:59,830 --> 01:40:56,480
evidence yeah that would be invaluable

2479
01:41:02,709 --> 01:40:59,840
absolutely if we have an experiencer who

2480
01:41:06,629 --> 01:41:02,719
has not engaged in sexual relations and

2481
01:41:10,390 --> 01:41:06,639
has the symptoms of pregnancy and then

2482
01:41:13,669 --> 01:41:10,400
has the symptoms of a miscarriage or

2483
01:41:16,070 --> 01:41:13,679
abortion and is able to collect tissue

2484
01:41:20,149 --> 01:41:16,080
samples wouldn't it be great if we had

2485
01:41:23,669 --> 01:41:20,159
scientists who would be able to evaluate

2486
01:41:25,109 --> 01:41:23,679
that immediately if we had geneticists

2487
01:41:27,270 --> 01:41:25,119
but we don't

2488
01:41:29,830 --> 01:41:27,280
have the funding

2489
01:41:31,910 --> 01:41:29,840
for that kind of work and that is the

2490
01:41:34,470 --> 01:41:31,920
biggest frustration that i have i think

2491
01:41:36,870 --> 01:41:34,480
it's the achilles heel of the field it

2492
01:41:38,550 --> 01:41:36,880
absolutely is yeah well here's an idea i

2493
01:41:40,629 --> 01:41:38,560
just it just popped into my mind while

2494
01:41:42,629 --> 01:41:40,639
we were talking about failing equipment

2495
01:41:46,070 --> 01:41:42,639
has anyone thought about putting a

2496
01:41:48,550 --> 01:41:46,080
little mini faraday cage around each of

2497
01:41:51,109 --> 01:41:48,560
the components of a surveillance system

2498
01:41:52,629 --> 01:41:51,119
to block all external

2499
01:41:54,070 --> 01:41:52,639
microwaves

2500
01:41:55,990 --> 01:41:54,080
electromagnetic

2501
01:41:58,229 --> 01:41:56,000
interference shall we say

2502
01:42:00,870 --> 01:41:58,239
which is what a faraday cage in in

2503
01:42:02,709 --> 01:42:00,880
theory is able to do uh you might pass

2504
01:42:03,830 --> 01:42:02,719
that along to your to your team out in

2505
01:42:05,990 --> 01:42:03,840
the field is

2506
01:42:07,590 --> 01:42:06,000
to fabricate some little faraday cages

2507
01:42:09,109 --> 01:42:07,600
and put it around each of the components

2508
01:42:10,229 --> 01:42:09,119
of the gear

2509
01:42:13,910 --> 01:42:10,239
you know

2510
01:42:16,149 --> 01:42:13,920
excellent idea it really is an excellent

2511
01:42:19,030 --> 01:42:16,159
idea and they're they're easy to make i

2512
01:42:21,669 --> 01:42:19,040
mean it's not a big deal yeah i i will

2513
01:42:24,149 --> 01:42:21,679
pass that on to some of the

2514
01:42:25,910 --> 01:42:24,159
investigators in the field who might be

2515
01:42:28,870 --> 01:42:25,920
able to do that kind of thing we

2516
01:42:31,189 --> 01:42:28,880
certainly have people like that in mufon

2517
01:42:34,470 --> 01:42:31,199
i think it's also important

2518
01:42:36,709 --> 01:42:34,480
to do social research and mufon is

2519
01:42:38,149 --> 01:42:36,719
engaged in a social research project

2520
01:42:41,830 --> 01:42:38,159
right now

2521
01:42:44,950 --> 01:42:41,840
if you go to mufon.com you will see

2522
01:42:47,189 --> 01:42:44,960
an experiencer survey and remember the

2523
01:42:48,950 --> 01:42:47,199
word survey not questionnaire because

2524
01:42:49,750 --> 01:42:48,960
there's also a questionnaire which is

2525
01:42:52,149 --> 01:42:49,760
just

2526
01:42:54,709 --> 01:42:52,159
a very short questionnaire

2527
01:42:56,790 --> 01:42:54,719
if you want to talk to a member of the

2528
01:42:59,830 --> 01:42:56,800
experience experiencer research team but

2529
01:43:02,070 --> 01:42:59,840
the experience or survey has a hundred

2530
01:43:05,189 --> 01:43:02,080
and eighteen questions

2531
01:43:08,629 --> 01:43:05,199
it is an expansion of a research project

2532
01:43:10,750 --> 01:43:08,639
that denise stoner and i did in 2012 to

2533
01:43:13,990 --> 01:43:10,760
identify commonalities among

2534
01:43:17,189 --> 01:43:14,000
experiencers and we also had a control

2535
01:43:19,510 --> 01:43:17,199
group back then too we are at the

2536
01:43:22,629 --> 01:43:19,520
beginning of this research project so if

2537
01:43:25,590 --> 01:43:22,639
there are experiencers listening please

2538
01:43:28,149 --> 01:43:25,600
go to mufon.com

2539
01:43:31,189 --> 01:43:28,159
it's on the home page

2540
01:43:33,590 --> 01:43:31,199
just scroll down to experiencer survey

2541
01:43:37,669 --> 01:43:33,600
it's powered by surveymonkey and we'd

2542
01:43:40,950 --> 01:43:37,679
certainly appreciate any input that we

2543
01:43:43,430 --> 01:43:40,960
can acquire we're we're hoping to get a

2544
01:43:47,109 --> 01:43:43,440
thousand responses the last time i

2545
01:43:49,270 --> 01:43:47,119
checked we had 118 many more that to

2546
01:43:51,270 --> 01:43:49,280
collect you know be great to get up to

2547
01:43:52,709 --> 01:43:51,280
about you know at least in four figures

2548
01:43:54,709 --> 01:43:52,719
you know

2549
01:43:56,070 --> 01:43:54,719
okay here's a question from vilmana

2550
01:43:58,310 --> 01:43:56,080
actually there's a couple of questions

2551
01:43:59,590 --> 01:43:58,320
both are very good are you aware of any

2552
01:44:02,310 --> 01:43:59,600
encounters

2553
01:44:05,030 --> 01:44:02,320
obviously we're talking abduction style

2554
01:44:07,830 --> 01:44:05,040
abduction like encounters involving

2555
01:44:10,950 --> 01:44:07,840
mystical or archetypal entities as

2556
01:44:14,790 --> 01:44:10,960
opposed to your space alien sort of

2557
01:44:17,590 --> 01:44:14,800
symbol uh archetype or motif i

2558
01:44:21,430 --> 01:44:17,600
actually am and and part of this came

2559
01:44:22,870 --> 01:44:21,440
from nancy talbot's research

2560
01:44:24,149 --> 01:44:22,880
over in europe

2561
01:44:27,430 --> 01:44:24,159
and

2562
01:44:30,470 --> 01:44:27,440
there is an ex crop circle experiencer

2563
01:44:31,350 --> 01:44:30,480
over there who is also

2564
01:44:35,910 --> 01:44:31,360
uh

2565
01:44:39,830 --> 01:44:38,310
what appears to be the virgin mary what

2566
01:44:42,950 --> 01:44:39,840
appears to be

2567
01:44:47,109 --> 01:44:42,960
jesus so there are these religious

2568
01:44:49,669 --> 01:44:47,119
figures uh i have received

2569
01:44:52,629 --> 01:44:49,679
some photographic evidence

2570
01:44:54,870 --> 01:44:52,639
of uh from from one man

2571
01:44:56,390 --> 01:44:54,880
of what appeared

2572
01:44:58,950 --> 01:44:56,400
to be

2573
01:45:01,669 --> 01:44:58,960
the devil coming up out of the ground

2574
01:45:04,629 --> 01:45:01,679
and this individual was having

2575
01:45:06,470 --> 01:45:04,639
the most horrific experiences

2576
01:45:08,390 --> 01:45:06,480
that you could possibly

2577
01:45:12,790 --> 01:45:08,400
imagine

2578
01:45:14,070 --> 01:45:12,800
it changes in in behavior of a family

2579
01:45:16,550 --> 01:45:14,080
member

2580
01:45:23,470 --> 01:45:16,560
we've got kathleen martin with gene and

2581
01:45:33,350 --> 01:45:28,830
[Music]

2582
01:45:34,669 --> 01:45:33,360
in thank you for listening to gcn

2583
01:45:37,430 --> 01:45:34,679
be sure to visit

2584
01:45:39,189 --> 01:45:37,440
gcnlive.com today

2585
01:45:41,189 --> 01:45:39,199
first game attack of the rockoids and it

2586
01:45:42,550 --> 01:45:41,199
was a critically acclaimed success and

2587
01:45:44,470 --> 01:45:42,560
now there is the coming of the

2588
01:45:46,629 --> 01:45:44,480
protectors a former military

2589
01:45:48,870 --> 01:45:46,639
intelligence man is contacted by a space

2590
01:45:51,430 --> 01:45:48,880
woman in a dream a dream that turns out

2591
01:45:53,030 --> 01:45:51,440
to be a nightmare because evil forces on

2592
01:45:55,270 --> 01:45:53,040
her distant planet are planning to

2593
01:45:57,830 --> 01:45:55,280
conquer the earth this is gripping

2594
01:45:59,669 --> 01:45:57,840
science fiction of the classic kind

2595
01:46:01,709 --> 01:45:59,679
attack of the rockoids and the coming of

2596
01:46:04,590 --> 01:46:01,719
the protectors find out more at

2597
01:46:07,030 --> 01:46:04,600
rockoaids.com that's rockoids

2598
01:46:08,950 --> 01:46:07,040
r-o-c-k-o-i-d-s dot com

2599
01:46:12,070 --> 01:46:08,960
so here's what happened i was placing an

2600
01:46:14,629 --> 01:46:12,080
order online the site went down it just

2601
01:46:16,550 --> 01:46:14,639
stopped responding it took hours before

2602
01:46:18,310 --> 01:46:16,560
it returned but i'd already placed the

2603
01:46:20,870 --> 01:46:18,320
order with another company if your site

2604
01:46:22,950 --> 01:46:20,880
goes down you could lose business and if

2605
01:46:25,270 --> 01:46:22,960
you have a business or personal site you

2606
01:46:28,629 --> 01:46:25,280
want to know it's easy to run and it

2607
01:46:31,350 --> 01:46:28,639
will stay online at iweb your site is

2608
01:46:33,950 --> 01:46:31,360
hosted on one of the most reliable

2609
01:46:39,030 --> 01:46:33,960
networks in the world check it out

2610
01:46:42,790 --> 01:46:40,629
don't complain about your cable bill

2611
01:46:44,790 --> 01:46:42,800
going up and up and up do something

2612
01:46:48,550 --> 01:46:44,800
about it grab a pencil and jot down this

2613
01:46:50,629 --> 01:46:48,560
special number 1 855 905 my tv the more

2614
01:46:53,189 --> 01:46:50,639
cable tv rates go up the better digital

2615
01:46:54,950 --> 01:46:53,199
satellite tv looks say goodbye to the

2616
01:46:57,430 --> 01:46:54,960
cable guy and get more of your favorite

2617
01:46:58,750 --> 01:46:57,440
channels in 100 digital quality for less

2618
01:47:01,669 --> 01:46:58,760
money call

2619
01:47:03,830 --> 01:47:01,679
1-855-905 my tv sign up for packages

2620
01:47:06,070 --> 01:47:03,840
starting as low as 19.99 and there's no

2621
01:47:08,229 --> 01:47:06,080
equipment to buy you get free hd tv

2622
01:47:10,310 --> 01:47:08,239
upgrade a free dvr upgrade and free

2623
01:47:12,709 --> 01:47:10,320
professional installation you control

2624
01:47:14,790 --> 01:47:12,719
what you watch when you watch it record

2625
01:47:17,590 --> 01:47:14,800
your favorite shows pause and rewind

2626
01:47:20,390 --> 01:47:17,600
live tv even skip the commercials watch

2627
01:47:22,229 --> 01:47:20,400
local channels too at just 19.99 what

2628
01:47:24,149 --> 01:47:22,239
are you waiting for pull out your major

2629
01:47:26,390 --> 01:47:24,159
credit or debit card call one eight five

2630
01:47:28,709 --> 01:47:26,400
five nine o five my tv one eight five

2631
01:47:31,350 --> 01:47:28,719
five nine o five my tv

2632
01:47:36,629 --> 01:47:31,360
say goodbye to the cable guy cut costs

2633
01:47:41,180 --> 01:47:36,639
and get more 1 855 905 my tv 1 855 905

2634
01:47:43,320 --> 01:47:42,000
[Applause]

2635
01:47:45,910 --> 01:47:43,330
[Music]

2636
01:47:49,189 --> 01:47:45,920
[Applause]

2637
01:47:52,790 --> 01:47:49,199
welcome back to the paracast the gold

2638
01:47:54,070 --> 01:47:52,800
standard of paranormal radio

2639
01:47:57,390 --> 01:47:54,080
and now

2640
01:48:01,350 --> 01:47:57,400
here's gene steinberg

2641
01:48:05,669 --> 01:48:03,270
all right so let's continue in our final

2642
01:48:07,590 --> 01:48:05,679
four segments with kathleen martin more

2643
01:48:09,669 --> 01:48:07,600
of her last response to a listener

2644
01:48:14,390 --> 01:48:09,679
question go ahead please

2645
01:48:17,350 --> 01:48:14,400
we also are i have received reports from

2646
01:48:20,870 --> 01:48:17,360
several individuals who are reporting

2647
01:48:24,310 --> 01:48:20,880
almost like biblical figures

2648
01:48:27,109 --> 01:48:24,320
people in robes with long flowing hair

2649
01:48:30,470 --> 01:48:27,119
and staffs and these are individuals who

2650
01:48:33,910 --> 01:48:30,480
have experienced missing time

2651
01:48:37,830 --> 01:48:33,920
they have not seen ufos prior to this

2652
01:48:39,350 --> 01:48:37,840
but a missing time experience and then

2653
01:48:42,229 --> 01:48:39,360
a change

2654
01:48:44,629 --> 01:48:42,239
in their consciousness

2655
01:48:48,709 --> 01:48:44,639
where they might have been

2656
01:48:50,229 --> 01:48:48,719
hunters they might have been sports fans

2657
01:48:53,030 --> 01:48:50,239
they might have been

2658
01:48:55,669 --> 01:48:53,040
meat eaters they suddenly

2659
01:48:58,870 --> 01:48:55,679
undergo this shift where

2660
01:49:01,590 --> 01:48:58,880
they have this experience and they're no

2661
01:49:03,990 --> 01:49:01,600
longer interested in violent sports or

2662
01:49:07,189 --> 01:49:04,000
competitive sports they're no longer

2663
01:49:09,990 --> 01:49:07,199
meat eaters they become vegetarian um

2664
01:49:13,270 --> 01:49:10,000
they uh suddenly are very concerned

2665
01:49:15,030 --> 01:49:13,280
about the earth's environment that sort

2666
01:49:18,310 --> 01:49:15,040
of thing so

2667
01:49:20,470 --> 01:49:18,320
i do have reports from a small number of

2668
01:49:22,550 --> 01:49:20,480
individuals who have undergone this kind

2669
01:49:24,390 --> 01:49:22,560
of consciousness shift yeah you

2670
01:49:26,390 --> 01:49:24,400
mentioned nancy talbot and of course i'm

2671
01:49:29,510 --> 01:49:26,400
i'm assuming that you're also referring

2672
01:49:32,390 --> 01:49:29,520
to robert brook who's been on the show

2673
01:49:34,709 --> 01:49:32,400
did not impress our listeners in fact so

2674
01:49:37,189 --> 01:49:34,719
we had a sleight of hand magician friend

2675
01:49:39,669 --> 01:49:37,199
there who he admitted was an expert in

2676
01:49:41,430 --> 01:49:39,679
sleight of hand magic

2677
01:49:43,270 --> 01:49:41,440
unfortunately i was on my way back from

2678
01:49:45,109 --> 01:49:43,280
lake havasu and was cutting in and out

2679
01:49:46,950 --> 01:49:45,119
on that episode but boy

2680
01:49:48,790 --> 01:49:46,960
it was quite the donny brook online

2681
01:49:51,430 --> 01:49:48,800
after uh the show and we had to have

2682
01:49:53,430 --> 01:49:51,440
nancy back i think a week or two later

2683
01:49:55,590 --> 01:49:53,440
to try to do some damage control which

2684
01:49:57,750 --> 01:49:55,600
did not work what do you make of the

2685
01:49:58,709 --> 01:49:57,760
robert vanderbilt case uh it's one of

2686
01:50:00,709 --> 01:49:58,719
the more

2687
01:50:02,470 --> 01:50:00,719
enigmatic cases that have come down the

2688
01:50:03,750 --> 01:50:02,480
pike in quite a while

2689
01:50:05,830 --> 01:50:03,760
uh it's

2690
01:50:08,070 --> 01:50:05,840
head and shoulders above the

2691
01:50:09,750 --> 01:50:08,080
stan romanette claims as far as i'm

2692
01:50:12,149 --> 01:50:09,760
concerned because you do have all this

2693
01:50:13,910 --> 01:50:12,159
very compelling the head-scratching

2694
01:50:15,990 --> 01:50:13,920
photographic evidence

2695
01:50:18,149 --> 01:50:16,000
some of the crop circle incidents have

2696
01:50:19,510 --> 01:50:18,159
been very very well documented much to

2697
01:50:21,990 --> 01:50:19,520
the chagrin

2698
01:50:24,070 --> 01:50:22,000
of all the detractors to

2699
01:50:25,750 --> 01:50:24,080
you know who dismissed the entire case

2700
01:50:27,590 --> 01:50:25,760
there are elements to the case that

2701
01:50:30,149 --> 01:50:27,600
can't be explained

2702
01:50:31,990 --> 01:50:30,159
and uh having you know known nancy for

2703
01:50:34,470 --> 01:50:32,000
many many years and knowing that she's

2704
01:50:36,390 --> 01:50:34,480
um she's she's she swallowed the the

2705
01:50:38,709 --> 01:50:36,400
bait boy and the hook and and she's

2706
01:50:40,149 --> 01:50:38,719
flopping on the end of that particular

2707
01:50:41,990 --> 01:50:40,159
fishing line

2708
01:50:44,470 --> 01:50:42,000
and it's unfortunate i think that she's

2709
01:50:45,990 --> 01:50:44,480
lost some objectivity around the case

2710
01:50:48,070 --> 01:50:46,000
but what do you make of it uh there's

2711
01:50:51,109 --> 01:50:48,080
some pretty bizarre stuff there

2712
01:50:52,870 --> 01:50:51,119
there is some pretty bizarre stuff i i

2713
01:50:57,030 --> 01:50:52,880
have looked at it

2714
01:50:59,590 --> 01:50:57,040
but i have not investigated it myself i

2715
01:51:02,470 --> 01:50:59,600
have not researched it to any

2716
01:51:05,510 --> 01:51:02,480
degree because i am so busy with my own

2717
01:51:08,390 --> 01:51:05,520
research that i i don't have the time to

2718
01:51:11,189 --> 01:51:08,400
be looking at a lot of other people's

2719
01:51:13,430 --> 01:51:11,199
research don't tell nancy that

2720
01:51:14,950 --> 01:51:13,440
i i do receive

2721
01:51:18,149 --> 01:51:14,960
the

2722
01:51:19,430 --> 01:51:18,159
reports that she sends out and i do look

2723
01:51:20,709 --> 01:51:19,440
at what

2724
01:51:21,669 --> 01:51:20,719
she has

2725
01:51:25,430 --> 01:51:21,679
and

2726
01:51:28,709 --> 01:51:25,440
i am hoping that she is using some kind

2727
01:51:29,990 --> 01:51:28,719
of controls i know for example when

2728
01:51:33,189 --> 01:51:30,000
mufon

2729
01:51:36,870 --> 01:51:33,199
was attempting to capture photographs we

2730
01:51:37,990 --> 01:51:36,880
had dual cameras and it was impossible

2731
01:51:42,790 --> 01:51:38,000
to

2732
01:51:45,910 --> 01:51:42,800
get the film out that that's back when

2733
01:51:48,149 --> 01:51:45,920
we had film that sort of thing so

2734
01:51:51,589 --> 01:51:48,159
i hope that she's using those kinds of

2735
01:51:55,109 --> 01:51:51,599
controls i found the the photographs

2736
01:51:58,149 --> 01:51:55,119
that she sent out to be interesting and

2737
01:52:00,470 --> 01:51:58,159
i do respect her as a researcher and i

2738
01:52:04,470 --> 01:52:00,480
hope that she's not being duped but any

2739
01:52:09,830 --> 01:52:06,950
okay well speaking of uh controversial

2740
01:52:13,109 --> 01:52:09,840
cases and perhaps uh

2741
01:52:14,310 --> 01:52:13,119
questionable uh motives in in some cases

2742
01:52:16,470 --> 01:52:14,320
uh by the

2743
01:52:20,390 --> 01:52:16,480
alleged experiencer another question

2744
01:52:22,870 --> 01:52:20,400
from vimana is has hypnotic regression

2745
01:52:25,109 --> 01:52:22,880
in you know this um experience or

2746
01:52:27,430 --> 01:52:25,119
abductee realm has has

2747
01:52:30,070 --> 01:52:27,440
a hypnotic regression session or series

2748
01:52:33,750 --> 01:52:30,080
of sessions ever uncovered actual mental

2749
01:52:36,310 --> 01:52:33,760
illness in a claimed abductee

2750
01:52:37,830 --> 01:52:36,320
if there is mental illness you don't

2751
01:52:40,870 --> 01:52:37,840
want to do

2752
01:52:43,830 --> 01:52:40,880
these hypnosis sessions to begin with

2753
01:52:46,470 --> 01:52:43,840
and the way to uncover mental illness in

2754
01:52:47,750 --> 01:52:46,480
an is in an experiencer

2755
01:52:50,709 --> 01:52:47,760
is to

2756
01:52:54,310 --> 01:52:50,719
do hypnosis without using the proper

2757
01:52:56,830 --> 01:52:54,320
precautions without uh following the

2758
01:52:59,270 --> 01:52:56,840
protocols that trained

2759
01:53:02,470 --> 01:52:59,280
hypnotherapists use

2760
01:53:03,830 --> 01:53:02,480
i had spoken earlier about an assessment

2761
01:53:05,189 --> 01:53:03,840
of risk

2762
01:53:08,950 --> 01:53:05,199
so yes

2763
01:53:12,709 --> 01:53:08,960
it can uncover a mental illness

2764
01:53:16,550 --> 01:53:12,719
if the the the hypnotherapist is not

2765
01:53:19,910 --> 01:53:16,560
ethical in what they're doing or if the

2766
01:53:23,350 --> 01:53:19,920
experiencer actually has a pre-existing

2767
01:53:26,310 --> 01:53:23,360
psychiatric condition and is lying

2768
01:53:28,709 --> 01:53:26,320
speaking of ethics and

2769
01:53:30,790 --> 01:53:28,719
abductee research

2770
01:53:32,310 --> 01:53:30,800
what's been going on with john carpenter

2771
01:53:34,950 --> 01:53:32,320
of course

2772
01:53:37,589 --> 01:53:34,960
about 10 years ago he was

2773
01:53:38,950 --> 01:53:37,599
kind of caught red-handed selling all

2774
01:53:44,149 --> 01:53:38,960
his

2775
01:53:46,229 --> 01:53:44,159
to nids to the robert bigelow national

2776
01:53:47,990 --> 01:53:46,239
institute for discovery sciences

2777
01:53:49,910 --> 01:53:48,000
and there was some question of whether

2778
01:53:51,990 --> 01:53:49,920
he even included the names of the

2779
01:53:54,470 --> 01:53:52,000
experiencers or not

2780
01:53:56,470 --> 01:53:54,480
have you heard anything about uh john

2781
01:53:57,189 --> 01:53:56,480
carpenter and and where do you come down

2782
01:54:01,430 --> 01:53:57,199
on

2783
01:54:04,870 --> 01:54:01,440
the highest bidder

2784
01:54:06,149 --> 01:54:04,880
well that is unethical as well

2785
01:54:08,390 --> 01:54:06,159
uh

2786
01:54:10,709 --> 01:54:08,400
he should have lost his his license to

2787
01:54:11,830 --> 01:54:10,719
practice for that sort of thing

2788
01:54:14,629 --> 01:54:11,840
because

2789
01:54:18,390 --> 01:54:14,639
you know that's simply not acceptable

2790
01:54:21,030 --> 01:54:18,400
uh for an ethical researcher

2791
01:54:23,830 --> 01:54:21,040
john had held a very high position in

2792
01:54:25,430 --> 01:54:23,840
mufon it was very embarrassing to move

2793
01:54:26,470 --> 01:54:25,440
on and

2794
01:54:30,790 --> 01:54:26,480
he

2795
01:54:32,310 --> 01:54:30,800
occurred i

2796
01:54:33,830 --> 01:54:32,320
talked to john

2797
01:54:35,990 --> 01:54:33,840
he came to

2798
01:54:37,990 --> 01:54:36,000
i believe it was roswell when i was

2799
01:54:38,950 --> 01:54:38,000
speaking down there two or three years

2800
01:54:40,629 --> 01:54:38,960
ago

2801
01:54:42,149 --> 01:54:40,639
talked to him

2802
01:54:44,390 --> 01:54:42,159
he was

2803
01:54:46,629 --> 01:54:44,400
more quietly continuing with his

2804
01:54:49,030 --> 01:54:46,639
research and i'm going to be speaking at

2805
01:54:52,149 --> 01:54:49,040
a conference in brazil

2806
01:54:54,390 --> 01:54:52,159
the first week in december right john

2807
01:54:57,109 --> 01:54:54,400
coming up going to be another speaker

2808
01:55:00,870 --> 01:54:57,119
there so i will be able to catch up with

2809
01:55:03,990 --> 01:55:00,880
him to to find out what is going on and

2810
01:55:06,390 --> 01:55:04,000
be able to hear his lecture on his ra

2811
01:55:08,229 --> 01:55:06,400
latest research as well

2812
01:55:10,870 --> 01:55:08,239
well a lot of people really came down

2813
01:55:13,430 --> 01:55:10,880
hard on him and in in justifiably so i

2814
01:55:14,629 --> 01:55:13,440
think there was absolutely yeah there

2815
01:55:16,149 --> 01:55:14,639
was some

2816
01:55:19,350 --> 01:55:16,159
questionable decision making going on

2817
01:55:22,470 --> 01:55:19,360
there in his uh in his uh you know

2818
01:55:24,070 --> 01:55:22,480
particular instance um one thing i will

2819
01:55:25,990 --> 01:55:24,080
say though is

2820
01:55:27,910 --> 01:55:26,000
up till that point i thought he was one

2821
01:55:30,070 --> 01:55:27,920
of the nicest sweetest most grounded

2822
01:55:32,950 --> 01:55:30,080
guys in the field

2823
01:55:36,229 --> 01:55:32,960
and i really liked him and i still do

2824
01:55:38,870 --> 01:55:36,239
but uh sky his uh his work down the

2825
01:55:40,470 --> 01:55:38,880
vagina case speaking of brazil uh was

2826
01:55:43,589 --> 01:55:40,480
very very good

2827
01:55:45,669 --> 01:55:43,599
um he was there very early on

2828
01:55:47,430 --> 01:55:45,679
and uh say hello for me it's been a

2829
01:55:49,750 --> 01:55:47,440
while since i've had a chance to to talk

2830
01:55:51,430 --> 01:55:49,760
to him say hi for me and say hi to david

2831
01:55:52,470 --> 01:55:51,440
childress he'll be down there as well

2832
01:55:55,030 --> 01:55:52,480
uh-huh

2833
01:55:56,950 --> 01:55:55,040
and aj of course and given my uh my

2834
01:55:58,470 --> 01:55:56,960
condolences on the tragic death of his

2835
01:56:00,390 --> 01:55:58,480
daughter last year

2836
01:56:02,870 --> 01:56:00,400
that was so unfortunate

2837
01:56:04,790 --> 01:56:02,880
really sad yeah really really really

2838
01:56:07,510 --> 01:56:04,800
hard for him i know because she was his

2839
01:56:09,350 --> 01:56:07,520
right arm and really did a lot for him

2840
01:56:10,870 --> 01:56:09,360
very very unfortunate and what a what a

2841
01:56:13,830 --> 01:56:10,880
just i mean

2842
01:56:17,430 --> 01:56:13,840
drop that gorgeous and talented

2843
01:56:19,109 --> 01:56:17,440
woman just really sad absolutely

2844
01:56:22,390 --> 01:56:19,119
and um

2845
01:56:24,470 --> 01:56:22,400
mary rodwell will also be speaking at

2846
01:56:25,910 --> 01:56:24,480
that conference researcher from

2847
01:56:29,510 --> 01:56:25,920
australia

2848
01:56:31,109 --> 01:56:29,520
and i have never met her in person so

2849
01:56:35,109 --> 01:56:31,119
it's going to give me the opportunity

2850
01:56:36,950 --> 01:56:35,119
both of us uh serve on a

2851
01:56:39,109 --> 01:56:36,960
research team

2852
01:56:42,229 --> 01:56:39,119
for the foundation for research into

2853
01:56:43,990 --> 01:56:42,239
extraterrestrial encounters and so i've

2854
01:56:46,470 --> 01:56:44,000
heard her voice and

2855
01:56:48,310 --> 01:56:46,480
but i have never really discussed her

2856
01:56:50,870 --> 01:56:48,320
research with her so

2857
01:56:53,990 --> 01:56:50,880
i'm looking forward to that

2858
01:56:55,830 --> 01:56:54,000
it should be fun i'm jealous

2859
01:56:57,750 --> 01:56:55,840
well it should be fun nothing like

2860
01:56:59,350 --> 01:56:57,760
springtime in brazil

2861
01:57:03,510 --> 01:56:59,360
yes

2862
01:57:07,350 --> 01:57:05,270
almost yeah late late spring early

2863
01:57:10,470 --> 01:57:07,360
summer yeah yeah

2864
01:57:12,470 --> 01:57:10,480
oh epinema

2865
01:57:15,030 --> 01:57:12,480
bikinis

2866
01:57:16,950 --> 01:57:15,040
okay settle down chris settle down

2867
01:57:18,790 --> 01:57:16,960
unless someone wants to send a plane

2868
01:57:20,629 --> 01:57:18,800
ticket to chris but then we'll never

2869
01:57:21,830 --> 01:57:20,639
hear from him again

2870
01:57:24,390 --> 01:57:21,840
cool

2871
01:57:26,149 --> 01:57:24,400
we will hear from kathleen martin in our

2872
01:57:32,230 --> 01:57:26,159
next segment with gina and chris you're

2873
01:57:39,589 --> 01:57:36,870
[Music]

2874
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2958
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2959
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2961
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2968
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we'd like to hear from you if you have a

2970
02:01:48,390 --> 02:01:44,800
comment or question about the paracast

2971
02:01:51,589 --> 02:01:48,400
send it to news at the paracast.com

2972
02:01:53,430 --> 02:01:51,599
that's news at the paracast.com

2973
02:01:55,910 --> 02:01:53,440
and don't forget to visit our famous

2974
02:01:58,750 --> 02:01:55,920
paracast community forums at

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forum.theparacast.com

2976
02:02:02,550 --> 02:02:00,400
[Music]

2977
02:02:05,189 --> 02:02:02,560
let me go to kind of a meta question

2978
02:02:07,189 --> 02:02:05,199
here before we go on now obviously all

2979
02:02:08,790 --> 02:02:07,199
the names you apply here and all the

2980
02:02:10,070 --> 02:02:08,800
descriptions

2981
02:02:12,070 --> 02:02:10,080
assume

2982
02:02:14,229 --> 02:02:12,080
we're dealing with e.t

2983
02:02:15,910 --> 02:02:14,239
but we do not know that for certain

2984
02:02:17,430 --> 02:02:15,920
we're assuming based on the evidence

2985
02:02:18,550 --> 02:02:17,440
that this seems to be the most probable

2986
02:02:20,870 --> 02:02:18,560
answer

2987
02:02:23,030 --> 02:02:20,880
but does it have to be e.t

2988
02:02:25,270 --> 02:02:23,040
well it appears to

2989
02:02:28,790 --> 02:02:25,280
be coming from

2990
02:02:32,149 --> 02:02:28,800
outside our earth although

2991
02:02:33,109 --> 02:02:32,159
they do appear to be living here as well

2992
02:02:35,750 --> 02:02:33,119
now

2993
02:02:38,790 --> 02:02:35,760
under the ocean in

2994
02:02:41,030 --> 02:02:38,800
underground bases so many people have

2995
02:02:42,310 --> 02:02:41,040
reported that and so many have seen them

2996
02:02:44,950 --> 02:02:42,320
coming up

2997
02:02:47,990 --> 02:02:44,960
out of the ocean and going back into the

2998
02:02:50,950 --> 02:02:48,000
ocean it's certainly easier than

2999
02:02:53,669 --> 02:02:50,960
moving in and out of our atmosphere and

3000
02:02:54,709 --> 02:02:53,679
possibly being shot at

3001
02:02:55,910 --> 02:02:54,719
so

3002
02:02:57,589 --> 02:02:55,920
in that

3003
02:03:01,229 --> 02:02:57,599
regard

3004
02:03:03,270 --> 02:03:01,239
i i think that it's fine to call them

3005
02:03:05,510 --> 02:03:03,280
extraterrestrials because they appear to

3006
02:03:07,990 --> 02:03:05,520
be from outside

3007
02:03:09,510 --> 02:03:08,000
this planet originating from outside

3008
02:03:11,350 --> 02:03:09,520
this planet whether they're

3009
02:03:13,189 --> 02:03:11,360
interdimensional

3010
02:03:14,709 --> 02:03:13,199
um you know

3011
02:03:15,750 --> 02:03:14,719
who knows

3012
02:03:18,550 --> 02:03:15,760
but

3013
02:03:21,790 --> 02:03:18,560
uh i think that we're also dealing with

3014
02:03:23,350 --> 02:03:21,800
other types of entities who are not

3015
02:03:24,229 --> 02:03:23,360
extraterrestrial

3016
02:03:27,510 --> 02:03:24,239
and

3017
02:03:29,750 --> 02:03:27,520
they fit more into the paranormal

3018
02:03:31,270 --> 02:03:29,760
realm of spiritual

3019
02:03:34,790 --> 02:03:31,280
entities

3020
02:03:35,990 --> 02:03:34,800
both positive and negative who might

3021
02:03:39,589 --> 02:03:36,000
have

3022
02:03:43,430 --> 02:03:39,599
parasitic attachments on individuals

3023
02:03:45,830 --> 02:03:43,440
and i've been contacted by many many

3024
02:03:48,390 --> 02:03:45,840
individuals who are having these kinds

3025
02:03:50,310 --> 02:03:48,400
of negative experiences

3026
02:03:53,109 --> 02:03:50,320
who

3027
02:03:56,790 --> 02:03:53,119
believe that they're being abducted by

3028
02:03:58,950 --> 02:03:56,800
aliens although they they never see a

3029
02:04:00,790 --> 02:03:58,960
flying saucer

3030
02:04:03,350 --> 02:04:00,800
this is happening when they go to bed at

3031
02:04:06,310 --> 02:04:03,360
night they're being taunted they might

3032
02:04:10,310 --> 02:04:06,320
end up with claw marks on their ankles

3033
02:04:12,709 --> 02:04:10,320
they're being held upside down

3034
02:04:14,229 --> 02:04:12,719
and and these people are not necessarily

3035
02:04:16,310 --> 02:04:14,239
mentally ill because that's something

3036
02:04:18,149 --> 02:04:16,320
else that you have to consider when

3037
02:04:20,149 --> 02:04:18,159
you're working with individuals like

3038
02:04:21,830 --> 02:04:20,159
this i found

3039
02:04:25,430 --> 02:04:21,840
two

3040
02:04:26,390 --> 02:04:25,440
reasons why this might be occurring

3041
02:04:29,030 --> 02:04:26,400
and

3042
02:04:31,189 --> 02:04:29,040
i can't say for sure

3043
02:04:33,430 --> 02:04:31,199
this is more or less speculation on my

3044
02:04:36,830 --> 02:04:33,440
part at this point

3045
02:04:40,149 --> 02:04:36,840
but one of those speculations is

3046
02:04:43,430 --> 02:04:40,159
that a commonality i found in most of

3047
02:04:45,109 --> 02:04:43,440
these individuals is that they have

3048
02:04:46,470 --> 02:04:45,119
abused alcohol

3049
02:04:49,589 --> 02:04:46,480
and drugs

3050
02:04:52,950 --> 02:04:49,599
they might not no longer be using them

3051
02:04:55,030 --> 02:04:52,960
but it seems to have opened them up so

3052
02:04:57,990 --> 02:04:55,040
that this negative

3053
02:04:59,669 --> 02:04:58,000
entity attachment could attach

3054
02:05:01,589 --> 02:04:59,679
to them

3055
02:05:03,510 --> 02:05:01,599
and and something else i forgot to

3056
02:05:06,470 --> 02:05:03,520
mention is they tend to have very high

3057
02:05:08,629 --> 02:05:06,480
electric bills too they seem to feed off

3058
02:05:10,870 --> 02:05:08,639
from human emotions

3059
02:05:12,390 --> 02:05:10,880
and and human bodies

3060
02:05:16,070 --> 02:05:12,400
another

3061
02:05:17,669 --> 02:05:16,080
possibility is that

3062
02:05:22,709 --> 02:05:17,679
they

3063
02:05:25,030 --> 02:05:22,719
angelic figures the religious figures

3064
02:05:27,589 --> 02:05:25,040
that individuals are having

3065
02:05:30,870 --> 02:05:27,599
conversations with these

3066
02:05:32,830 --> 02:05:30,880
sort of angelic or religious

3067
02:05:34,550 --> 02:05:32,840
uh

3068
02:05:37,189 --> 02:05:34,560
iridescent

3069
02:05:40,310 --> 02:05:37,199
uh they're not quite solid

3070
02:05:42,550 --> 02:05:40,320
figures will come and individuals tell

3071
02:05:44,070 --> 02:05:42,560
me they've been very very ill and

3072
02:05:46,470 --> 02:05:44,080
they've been healed or they've been

3073
02:05:48,950 --> 02:05:46,480
given soothing words

3074
02:05:52,149 --> 02:05:48,960
by these individuals so

3075
02:05:55,189 --> 02:05:52,159
you know i think that we have more than

3076
02:05:58,790 --> 02:05:55,199
one thing going on here and i think we

3077
02:06:00,870 --> 02:05:58,800
probably have many things going on here

3078
02:06:03,510 --> 02:06:00,880
maybe it's barbara eden coming back from

3079
02:06:07,910 --> 02:06:03,520
the grave and that's like a case of i

3080
02:06:12,470 --> 02:06:10,149
or is it the gin well nobody's ever

3081
02:06:16,470 --> 02:06:12,480
reported a genie to me that one now that

3082
02:06:20,310 --> 02:06:16,480
would be unique um actually uh i think

3083
02:06:22,790 --> 02:06:20,320
who was it uh ann druffle had some cases

3084
02:06:24,950 --> 02:06:22,800
back in the 70s that were

3085
02:06:26,790 --> 02:06:24,960
highly intriguing

3086
02:06:28,629 --> 02:06:26,800
where um

3087
02:06:31,589 --> 02:06:28,639
she could come to no other conclusion

3088
02:06:32,470 --> 02:06:31,599
than the person

3089
02:06:34,550 --> 02:06:32,480
had

3090
02:06:36,870 --> 02:06:34,560
some sort of gin attachment of course we

3091
02:06:38,550 --> 02:06:36,880
all suppose we have two gins attached to

3092
02:06:39,830 --> 02:06:38,560
each and every one of us

3093
02:06:41,510 --> 02:06:39,840
and of course the work of rosemary

3094
02:06:44,229 --> 02:06:41,520
guiley would

3095
02:06:45,830 --> 02:06:44,239
open a few eyes i think in terms of this

3096
02:06:49,350 --> 02:06:45,840
but

3097
02:06:52,390 --> 02:06:49,360
i i totally agree kathleen i mean

3098
02:06:54,870 --> 02:06:52,400
were it so convenient that this could

3099
02:06:56,229 --> 02:06:54,880
all just be aliens from outer space it's

3100
02:06:58,550 --> 02:06:56,239
too complex

3101
02:07:00,229 --> 02:06:58,560
there's too many conflicting signals

3102
02:07:02,950 --> 02:07:00,239
there's too many uh differing

3103
02:07:05,669 --> 02:07:02,960
descriptions there's too many counter

3104
02:07:08,229 --> 02:07:05,679
even you know exact opposite agendas

3105
02:07:11,030 --> 02:07:08,239
that are expressed either

3106
02:07:12,790 --> 02:07:11,040
this is complete tricksterism on some

3107
02:07:14,950 --> 02:07:12,800
level or

3108
02:07:17,830 --> 02:07:14,960
we are dealing with competing agendas

3109
02:07:20,390 --> 02:07:17,840
and competing i guess motivations

3110
02:07:22,470 --> 02:07:20,400
it appears to me and that if it's one

3111
02:07:23,750 --> 02:07:22,480
race et's

3112
02:07:26,229 --> 02:07:23,760
they got to come to some sort of

3113
02:07:28,069 --> 02:07:26,239
consensus and like work out a uh an

3114
02:07:30,229 --> 02:07:28,079
agreed-upon plan here because we have

3115
02:07:32,629 --> 02:07:30,239
too much conflicting information we

3116
02:07:35,750 --> 02:07:32,639
certainly do and and it's so confusing

3117
02:07:38,709 --> 02:07:35,760
and that's why i cannot be polarized at

3118
02:07:41,030 --> 02:07:38,719
one end of the scale or the other

3119
02:07:43,990 --> 02:07:41,040
because there is so much conflicting

3120
02:07:46,470 --> 02:07:44,000
information and it's so very very

3121
02:07:49,669 --> 02:07:46,480
complicated well and also because you're

3122
02:07:53,030 --> 02:07:52,149
as soon as somebody jumps in off the

3123
02:07:55,189 --> 02:07:53,040
fence

3124
02:07:57,990 --> 02:07:55,199
into one particular

3125
02:07:59,430 --> 02:07:58,000
you know steadfast scenario to me that

3126
02:08:02,229 --> 02:07:59,440
is them

3127
02:08:04,069 --> 02:08:02,239
committing harry carey in the field

3128
02:08:04,950 --> 02:08:04,079
as soon as you start to lump everything

3129
02:08:07,990 --> 02:08:04,960
in

3130
02:08:11,189 --> 02:08:08,000
to one particular theory one particular

3131
02:08:13,510 --> 02:08:11,199
conclusion which cannot be proven you

3132
02:08:14,950 --> 02:08:13,520
have really sunk yourself in terms of

3133
02:08:17,350 --> 02:08:14,960
credibility

3134
02:08:19,350 --> 02:08:17,360
in the eyes of people like myself and

3135
02:08:20,629 --> 02:08:19,360
gene and you people that tend to be more

3136
02:08:23,109 --> 02:08:20,639
circumspect about this and more

3137
02:08:24,629 --> 02:08:23,119
objective and and tend to be open-minded

3138
02:08:25,510 --> 02:08:24,639
but skeptical

3139
02:08:27,990 --> 02:08:25,520
and

3140
02:08:30,629 --> 02:08:28,000
let the data let the evidence

3141
02:08:31,750 --> 02:08:30,639
and let the the the patterning sort of

3142
02:08:34,069 --> 02:08:31,760
unfold

3143
02:08:37,030 --> 02:08:34,079
supported by um

3144
02:08:38,790 --> 02:08:37,040
you know the stuff that uh supports the

3145
02:08:40,229 --> 02:08:38,800
conclusion that something's going on i

3146
02:08:41,669 --> 02:08:40,239
mean we all agree that something is

3147
02:08:44,149 --> 02:08:41,679
going on but

3148
02:08:47,669 --> 02:08:44,159
man you know talking with with david uh

3149
02:08:50,709 --> 02:08:47,679
a few weeks back and him saying well now

3150
02:08:52,310 --> 02:08:50,719
abductees are being brainwashed into

3151
02:08:54,629 --> 02:08:52,320
going into

3152
02:08:56,390 --> 02:08:54,639
you know these blank out periods where

3153
02:08:58,870 --> 02:08:56,400
they're actually going out

3154
02:08:59,910 --> 02:08:58,880
and taking abductees to walmart and

3155
02:09:01,030 --> 02:08:59,920
teaching them

3156
02:09:03,189 --> 02:09:01,040
hubrids

3157
02:09:05,350 --> 02:09:03,199
are being taken out to be shown how to

3158
02:09:07,990 --> 02:09:05,360
shop how to pay their bills how to

3159
02:09:09,669 --> 02:09:08,000
integrate themselves in into society

3160
02:09:11,910 --> 02:09:09,679
have you had a single case that would

3161
02:09:14,870 --> 02:09:11,920
suggest that that's a true scenario

3162
02:09:17,189 --> 02:09:14,880
i have not had a single case

3163
02:09:19,669 --> 02:09:17,199
where anything close to that

3164
02:09:22,870 --> 02:09:19,679
has been mentioned

3165
02:09:25,109 --> 02:09:22,880
you know so i don't know what to make

3166
02:09:26,790 --> 02:09:25,119
out of all of this i'm not going to say

3167
02:09:29,189 --> 02:09:26,800
it's impossible

3168
02:09:31,270 --> 02:09:29,199
but i do know

3169
02:09:35,589 --> 02:09:31,280
based upon the work of

3170
02:09:37,910 --> 02:09:35,599
daryl sims for example and others that

3171
02:09:39,430 --> 02:09:37,920
there these et's

3172
02:09:43,510 --> 02:09:39,440
appear to be

3173
02:09:45,669 --> 02:09:43,520
attaching a type of implant or camera

3174
02:09:50,069 --> 02:09:45,679
to the optic nerve

3175
02:09:52,629 --> 02:09:50,079
experiencers also have implants that

3176
02:09:54,069 --> 02:09:52,639
can receive information

3177
02:10:00,870 --> 02:09:54,079
or

3178
02:10:02,790 --> 02:10:00,880
there'll be evidence of that unless you

3179
02:10:04,950 --> 02:10:02,800
use the word alleged implants because i

3180
02:10:05,750 --> 02:10:04,960
have not heard of any implant that has

3181
02:10:08,550 --> 02:10:05,760
been

3182
02:10:11,510 --> 02:10:08,560
analyzed with the rigors of science that

3183
02:10:12,390 --> 02:10:11,520
have determined that it is truly uh some

3184
02:10:14,390 --> 02:10:12,400
sort of

3185
02:10:15,589 --> 02:10:14,400
alien implant something that's not of

3186
02:10:16,870 --> 02:10:15,599
this earth

3187
02:10:19,109 --> 02:10:16,880
we'll have our answer in our next

3188
02:10:27,510 --> 02:10:19,119
segment okay with gene and chris and

3189
02:10:27,520 --> 02:10:32,229
thank you for listening to gcn

3190
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asking the questions but it just doesn't

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seem that you're getting the right

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struggling against an inevitable crisis

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but they're about to lose control when

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this happens it will rip our country

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apart in ways you never imagined from

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02:13:28,390 --> 02:13:26,639
where we shop to the family you want to

3265
02:13:30,950 --> 02:13:28,400
protect look i've made predictions like

3266
02:13:33,350 --> 02:13:30,960
this before a few years ago i warned

3267
02:13:35,510 --> 02:13:33,360
that the housing prices would collapse

3268
02:13:38,149 --> 02:13:35,520
before that i warned that dot-com

3269
02:13:40,069 --> 02:13:38,159
companies would crash and they did those

3270
02:13:42,310 --> 02:13:40,079
who listened had a chance to save

3271
02:13:44,390 --> 02:13:42,320
themselves but this has nothing to do

3272
02:13:47,589 --> 02:13:44,400
with the stock market this will affect

3273
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us all i've posted a free video at

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maybe you'll disagree with my

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conclusions but first you need to watch

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hi this is james fox from chasing ufos

3299
02:14:52,069 --> 02:14:46,400
you're listening to the paracast the

3300
02:14:56,310 --> 02:14:54,470
about alien implants in the power cast

3301
02:14:57,350 --> 02:14:56,320
with kathleen martin your response

3302
02:14:59,270 --> 02:14:57,360
please

3303
02:15:02,149 --> 02:14:59,280
well let me say

3304
02:15:04,390 --> 02:15:02,159
i will add alleged to this

3305
02:15:06,950 --> 02:15:04,400
if these alleged

3306
02:15:09,550 --> 02:15:06,960
uh implants are attached to the optic

3307
02:15:12,629 --> 02:15:09,560
nerve and if

3308
02:15:15,270 --> 02:15:12,639
experiencers do have the alleged

3309
02:15:17,589 --> 02:15:15,280
implants in their bodies

3310
02:15:20,830 --> 02:15:17,599
then

3311
02:15:24,709 --> 02:15:20,840
why do they need to put

3312
02:15:28,310 --> 02:15:24,719
hubrids on earth to learn about life

3313
02:15:29,750 --> 02:15:28,320
on earth when all they have to do

3314
02:15:36,470 --> 02:15:29,760
is

3315
02:15:39,510 --> 02:15:36,480
of life here and they would know

3316
02:15:42,550 --> 02:15:39,520
everything that they do they would see

3317
02:15:45,589 --> 02:15:42,560
an experiencer they would going to the

3318
02:15:46,790 --> 02:15:45,599
grocery store going yeah in

3319
02:15:49,030 --> 02:15:46,800
everything

3320
02:15:51,990 --> 02:15:49,040
this is probably going on if this whole

3321
02:15:54,149 --> 02:15:52,000
scenario is real i think what jacobs was

3322
02:15:55,830 --> 02:15:54,159
trying to get across is these hubrids

3323
02:15:59,189 --> 02:15:55,840
are being inserted as

3324
02:16:02,229 --> 02:15:59,199
as manchurian candidates as as uh you

3325
02:16:03,109 --> 02:16:02,239
know wrinkles in in in the agenda uh

3326
02:16:04,629 --> 02:16:03,119
that

3327
02:16:07,750 --> 02:16:04,639
are going to create

3328
02:16:10,470 --> 02:16:07,760
and enact some sort of agenda is is kind

3329
02:16:13,109 --> 02:16:10,480
of the inference that we got it's it's

3330
02:16:14,790 --> 02:16:13,119
it's now become a proactive

3331
02:16:17,030 --> 02:16:14,800
program on the part of the aliens

3332
02:16:18,790 --> 02:16:17,040
according to jacobs that the that these

3333
02:16:21,990 --> 02:16:18,800
people need to be trained how to

3334
02:16:25,030 --> 02:16:22,000
effectively slide into um society and

3335
02:16:26,390 --> 02:16:25,040
into the culture uh unseen and and

3336
02:16:28,229 --> 02:16:26,400
undetected

3337
02:16:31,030 --> 02:16:28,239
one thing it's contradictory here it

3338
02:16:33,429 --> 02:16:31,040
kind of assumes that et is very dumb so

3339
02:16:35,830 --> 02:16:33,439
if et's feeding hybrids or hybrids

3340
02:16:36,629 --> 02:16:35,840
certainly they have the capabilities

3341
02:16:38,070 --> 02:16:36,639
of

3342
02:16:39,509 --> 02:16:38,080
educating

3343
02:16:42,309 --> 02:16:39,519
these

3344
02:16:45,030 --> 02:16:42,319
people beings whatever into our way of

3345
02:16:47,990 --> 02:16:45,040
life having to call upon abductees to

3346
02:16:52,070 --> 02:16:48,000
become teachers says sounds downright

3347
02:16:55,190 --> 02:16:52,080
absurd doesn't it and unwilling teachers

3348
02:16:57,830 --> 02:16:55,200
at that sure it sounds like a good

3349
02:16:58,950 --> 02:16:57,840
screenplay if you read susie hanson's

3350
02:17:01,150 --> 02:16:58,960
book

3351
02:17:03,030 --> 02:17:01,160
she talks about

3352
02:17:05,030 --> 02:17:03,040
experiencers who

3353
02:17:07,830 --> 02:17:05,040
are willingly

3354
02:17:11,429 --> 02:17:07,840
on the craft participating in these

3355
02:17:12,629 --> 02:17:11,439
activities and being prepared for a time

3356
02:17:15,830 --> 02:17:12,639
when

3357
02:17:19,270 --> 02:17:15,840
a great tragedy might happen on earth

3358
02:17:24,150 --> 02:17:19,280
and that they would be there uh to carry

3359
02:17:26,469 --> 02:17:24,160
out the agenda of the et's who

3360
02:17:29,190 --> 02:17:26,479
are allegedly

3361
02:17:32,469 --> 02:17:29,200
going to be saving earth but there will

3362
02:17:35,750 --> 02:17:32,479
be great destruction as well and you get

3363
02:17:38,309 --> 02:17:35,760
these recurring themes uh between susie

3364
02:17:40,790 --> 02:17:38,319
hanson and david jacobs who are at

3365
02:17:44,070 --> 02:17:40,800
opposite ends of the spectrum in their

3366
02:17:46,709 --> 02:17:44,080
interpretation of what is going on but

3367
02:17:49,509 --> 02:17:46,719
essentially they're giving the same

3368
02:17:53,669 --> 02:17:49,519
information in terms of the evidence in

3369
02:17:56,629 --> 02:17:53,679
terms of the programs that these ets are

3370
02:18:00,469 --> 02:17:56,639
about to carry out so as a scholar

3371
02:18:03,429 --> 02:18:00,479
that's very very interesting to me to

3372
02:18:04,469 --> 02:18:03,439
make those comparisons and and to really

3373
02:18:07,270 --> 02:18:04,479
wonder

3374
02:18:09,589 --> 02:18:07,280
uh what is going on what sounds most

3375
02:18:13,270 --> 02:18:09,599
reasonable here or is any of it

3376
02:18:15,509 --> 02:18:13,280
reasonable well you know again that's

3377
02:18:17,429 --> 02:18:15,519
that's a very good question you know

3378
02:18:20,150 --> 02:18:17,439
going back to the whole idea of implants

3379
02:18:21,910 --> 02:18:20,160
do we have any irrefutable evidence that

3380
02:18:24,469 --> 02:18:21,920
implants have been found within a human

3381
02:18:25,990 --> 02:18:24,479
being that cannot be

3382
02:18:28,870 --> 02:18:26,000
explained away

3383
02:18:32,070 --> 02:18:28,880
by by science well it depends upon

3384
02:18:36,389 --> 02:18:32,080
whether or not you have respect for

3385
02:18:39,030 --> 02:18:36,399
roger lear and steve colburn's work the

3386
02:18:40,950 --> 02:18:39,040
their implants that steve colburn

3387
02:18:43,270 --> 02:18:40,960
uh analyzed

3388
02:18:46,150 --> 02:18:43,280
and has written about yeah but they were

3389
02:18:48,790 --> 02:18:46,160
his implants and they had unusual they

3390
02:18:51,750 --> 02:18:48,800
had highly unusual properties

3391
02:18:53,830 --> 02:18:51,760
they were comprised of rare earths and

3392
02:18:54,709 --> 02:18:53,840
meteoric material

3393
02:18:57,910 --> 02:18:54,719
they

3394
02:18:59,030 --> 02:18:57,920
used nanotechnology that we were not

3395
02:19:00,070 --> 02:18:59,040
capable

3396
02:19:03,910 --> 02:19:00,080
of

3397
02:19:05,429 --> 02:19:03,920
replicating on earth at that time

3398
02:19:07,669 --> 02:19:05,439
you know so

3399
02:19:08,870 --> 02:19:07,679
if you have respect for his work then

3400
02:19:11,030 --> 02:19:08,880
the answer

3401
02:19:13,030 --> 02:19:11,040
is yes no is he the guy that was in the

3402
02:19:15,110 --> 02:19:13,040
bandana on the video

3403
02:19:16,870 --> 02:19:15,120
that he was describing

3404
02:19:17,910 --> 02:19:16,880
weren't they implants that they took out

3405
02:19:20,709 --> 02:19:17,920
of him

3406
02:19:22,389 --> 02:19:20,719
uh steve colburn is a material scientist

3407
02:19:23,669 --> 02:19:22,399
right and there were implants that they

3408
02:19:24,709 --> 02:19:23,679
were found

3409
02:19:27,110 --> 02:19:24,719
video

3410
02:19:29,110 --> 02:19:27,120
uh i read reports

3411
02:19:31,589 --> 02:19:29,120
well he was the one that had the

3412
02:19:34,230 --> 02:19:31,599
implants in him he did not mention that

3413
02:19:36,389 --> 02:19:34,240
he was the one right and that's not many

3414
02:19:37,830 --> 02:19:36,399
people know that but just for your own

3415
02:19:40,870 --> 02:19:37,840
just for your own

3416
02:19:42,790 --> 02:19:40,880
um information yeah uh those implants

3417
02:19:44,629 --> 02:19:42,800
were taken from him

3418
02:19:46,830 --> 02:19:44,639
okay so he probably shouldn't have been

3419
02:19:48,469 --> 02:19:46,840
the one who was doing

3420
02:19:54,870 --> 02:19:48,479
uh

3421
02:19:55,590 --> 02:19:54,880
believe that as a scientist you can also

3422
02:19:56,870 --> 02:19:55,600
be

3423
02:19:59,110 --> 02:19:56,880
objective

3424
02:20:01,590 --> 02:19:59,120
uh you're true true well how about the

3425
02:20:03,429 --> 02:20:01,600
implant that that lear

3426
02:20:06,230 --> 02:20:03,439
mentioned this would have been back in i

3427
02:20:07,910 --> 02:20:06,240
think 2005 or six

3428
02:20:09,990 --> 02:20:07,920
where he got up i think it was at the

3429
02:20:11,910 --> 02:20:10,000
national press club i i may be wrong but

3430
02:20:14,830 --> 02:20:11,920
he got up and said we have an implant

3431
02:20:16,870 --> 02:20:14,840
that is actually we are detecting

3432
02:20:18,950 --> 02:20:16,880
transmissions coming from some sort of

3433
02:20:20,630 --> 02:20:18,960
signal is coming from it we will have an

3434
02:20:22,710 --> 02:20:20,640
announcement about this it is being

3435
02:20:24,950 --> 02:20:22,720
analyzed and i haven't heard a single

3436
02:20:27,990 --> 02:20:24,960
thing about it in

3437
02:20:30,790 --> 02:20:28,000
10 years right radio microwave frequency

3438
02:20:33,670 --> 02:20:30,800
that would broadcast into deep space

3439
02:20:36,870 --> 02:20:33,680
right and i haven't heard

3440
02:20:39,830 --> 02:20:36,880
more about that either

3441
02:20:43,030 --> 02:20:39,840
i don't know if this research is being

3442
02:20:45,349 --> 02:20:43,040
blocked if there simply is not funding

3443
02:20:48,469 --> 02:20:45,359
to carry through with it i know that

3444
02:20:50,230 --> 02:20:48,479
there's been a lot of skepticism about

3445
02:20:52,389 --> 02:20:50,240
the fact that roger died didn't help

3446
02:20:54,469 --> 02:20:52,399
matters no it certainly didn't and we

3447
02:20:57,750 --> 02:20:54,479
don't have anyone to replace him i do

3448
02:21:00,230 --> 02:20:57,760
know that daryl sims is uh

3449
02:21:03,830 --> 02:21:00,240
carrying out some of this research he

3450
02:21:06,070 --> 02:21:03,840
was recently in india um for with a

3451
02:21:09,270 --> 02:21:06,080
medical team right how did that go and

3452
02:21:10,630 --> 02:21:09,280
did you hear about uh how how that ended

3453
02:21:12,870 --> 02:21:10,640
up going i saw

3454
02:21:14,309 --> 02:21:12,880
i think some posts about him being there

3455
02:21:15,910 --> 02:21:14,319
some photographs and stuff but i haven't

3456
02:21:17,830 --> 02:21:15,920
heard anything about

3457
02:21:19,670 --> 02:21:17,840
uh how the trip went uh have you heard

3458
02:21:22,070 --> 02:21:19,680
anything well he said it was highly

3459
02:21:24,710 --> 02:21:22,080
successful he he wrote to me he and i

3460
02:21:28,550 --> 02:21:24,720
write to each other sometimes as well

3461
02:21:31,990 --> 02:21:28,560
we're we're friends and uh

3462
02:21:35,349 --> 02:21:32,000
i have not heard the results of

3463
02:21:36,630 --> 02:21:35,359
a scientific analysis on the implant and

3464
02:21:38,550 --> 02:21:36,640
and that's the thing that's most

3465
02:21:41,110 --> 02:21:38,560
important to me what does that

3466
02:21:43,510 --> 02:21:41,120
scientific analysis show

3467
02:21:46,070 --> 02:21:43,520
i don't care about the drama of re

3468
02:21:47,270 --> 02:21:46,080
removing it well i like daryl i think

3469
02:21:48,950 --> 02:21:47,280
he's um

3470
02:21:53,750 --> 02:21:48,960
he's

3471
02:21:56,630 --> 02:21:53,760
um i've known him for over 20 years i've

3472
02:21:59,270 --> 02:21:56,640
looked at his jewelry box that he

3473
02:22:00,870 --> 02:21:59,280
you know now now i think it's in a

3474
02:22:02,230 --> 02:22:00,880
the case that he keeps the implants is

3475
02:22:04,469 --> 02:22:02,240
now in a locked

3476
02:22:05,990 --> 02:22:04,479
uh little briefcase that he keeps locked

3477
02:22:07,590 --> 02:22:06,000
around his wrist

3478
02:22:09,590 --> 02:22:07,600
which i think is

3479
02:22:11,030 --> 02:22:09,600
kind of humorous uh stop stop for a

3480
02:22:13,110 --> 02:22:11,040
second chris because i think our

3481
02:22:15,750 --> 02:22:13,120
listeners will hear this and we'll go

3482
02:22:19,190 --> 02:22:15,760
past them and they'll say what did he

3483
02:22:21,590 --> 02:22:19,200
say let me rewind let me rewind that and

3484
02:22:23,030 --> 02:22:21,600
hear that again

3485
02:22:25,510 --> 02:22:23,040
with which

3486
02:22:27,510 --> 02:22:25,520
yeah uh he did a thing on comedy central

3487
02:22:29,670 --> 02:22:27,520
where he had his implants in a

3488
02:22:31,750 --> 02:22:29,680
in a high-tech looking briefcase and it

3489
02:22:34,469 --> 02:22:31,760
was handcuffed to his uh

3490
02:22:36,950 --> 02:22:34,479
to his wrist uh i i would have advised

3491
02:22:38,469 --> 02:22:36,960
him not to do the daily show or

3492
02:22:40,070 --> 02:22:38,479
comedy central

3493
02:22:42,950 --> 02:22:40,080
he did not come out looking very well

3494
02:22:45,190 --> 02:22:42,960
but my point being is i've looked at his

3495
02:22:47,270 --> 02:22:45,200
collection of implants and was able to

3496
02:22:49,429 --> 02:22:47,280
instantly identify

3497
02:22:51,270 --> 02:22:49,439
at least four or five or six of them one

3498
02:22:53,590 --> 02:22:51,280
was a finishing nail the other was

3499
02:22:56,070 --> 02:22:53,600
obviously a sliver of glass

3500
02:22:58,950 --> 02:22:56,080
there was other foreign objects with

3501
02:23:00,710 --> 02:22:58,960
calcification around them i mean i'm not

3502
02:23:02,230 --> 02:23:00,720
an expert and i could tell just by

3503
02:23:04,870 --> 02:23:02,240
looking at these objects that they were

3504
02:23:08,230 --> 02:23:04,880
mundane objects that the body was unable

3505
02:23:11,030 --> 02:23:08,240
to expel and so uh protected itself

3506
02:23:13,910 --> 02:23:11,040
by putting tissue around it and uh

3507
02:23:15,670 --> 02:23:13,920
you know you would think with with a a

3508
02:23:17,990 --> 02:23:15,680
selection of i don't know several you

3509
02:23:19,670 --> 02:23:18,000
know a couple dozen at least three dozen

3510
02:23:22,150 --> 02:23:19,680
objects that we should have some sort of

3511
02:23:23,030 --> 02:23:22,160
material science paper that has been

3512
02:23:25,510 --> 02:23:23,040
done

3513
02:23:26,790 --> 02:23:25,520
on the best of them and and we can

3514
02:23:28,469 --> 02:23:26,800
ascertain

3515
02:23:30,309 --> 02:23:28,479
you know once and for all that these are

3516
02:23:32,870 --> 02:23:30,319
objects that are uh that are

3517
02:23:34,469 --> 02:23:32,880
unexplainable you know i have one

3518
02:23:37,110 --> 02:23:34,479
other issue to add before we go to our

3519
02:23:40,309 --> 02:23:37,120
next segment and that is here

3520
02:23:41,270 --> 02:23:40,319
if et is really putting these rfid chips

3521
02:23:43,590 --> 02:23:41,280
on us

3522
02:23:45,270 --> 02:23:43,600
to track us to see what's going on

3523
02:23:47,910 --> 02:23:45,280
they're traveling here from other star

3524
02:23:50,309 --> 02:23:47,920
systems in theory they could

3525
02:23:53,990 --> 02:23:50,319
put something there that would be almost

3526
02:23:57,510 --> 02:23:54,000
impossible to detect it'd be so tiny

3527
02:23:59,830 --> 02:23:57,520
it would be at the molecular level

3528
02:24:01,429 --> 02:23:59,840
sure you wouldn't be able to detect it

3529
02:24:03,349 --> 02:24:01,439
you wouldn't be able to recover it it

3530
02:24:05,910 --> 02:24:03,359
wouldn't be something you just kind of

3531
02:24:07,429 --> 02:24:05,920
pry out of their arm or shoulder blades

3532
02:24:10,630 --> 02:24:07,439
or something i mean one of the objects

3533
02:24:13,270 --> 02:24:10,640
gene was a finishing nail it was obvious

3534
02:24:15,750 --> 02:24:13,280
of course that's the little tiny quarter

3535
02:24:18,070 --> 02:24:15,760
inch finishing now we have some small

3536
02:24:20,230 --> 02:24:18,080
little tiny announcements

3537
02:24:28,230 --> 02:24:20,240
not so tiny with gina and chris you're

3538
02:24:32,349 --> 02:24:31,429
thank you for listening to gcn

3539
02:24:36,790 --> 02:24:32,359
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3590
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3591
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3592
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to the cable guy and get more of your

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3636
02:28:47,590 --> 02:28:45,590
hi this is joshua p warren author of the

3637
02:28:49,990 --> 02:28:47,600
poor man's paranormal and you're

3638
02:28:53,500 --> 02:28:50,000
listening to the paracast the gold

3639
02:29:00,309 --> 02:28:53,510
standard of paranormal radio

3640
02:29:04,790 --> 02:29:02,630
with gene and chris on the power cast

3641
02:29:07,190 --> 02:29:04,800
we're talking a little bit about alien

3642
02:29:09,670 --> 02:29:07,200
implants kathleen martin can you see our

3643
02:29:12,070 --> 02:29:09,680
skepticism i can i can see your

3644
02:29:15,590 --> 02:29:12,080
skepticism let me speak a little bit

3645
02:29:17,590 --> 02:29:15,600
about uh alien implants i am aware of

3646
02:29:19,030 --> 02:29:17,600
actually i was the investigator on one

3647
02:29:23,190 --> 02:29:19,040
of the cases

3648
02:29:26,469 --> 02:29:23,200
where the individual's physician removed

3649
02:29:30,230 --> 02:29:26,479
what appeared to be an implant from his

3650
02:29:32,710 --> 02:29:30,240
body it was preserved it was sent to

3651
02:29:34,830 --> 02:29:32,720
mufon headquarters

3652
02:29:37,190 --> 02:29:34,840
and scheduled to be sent to the

3653
02:29:39,190 --> 02:29:37,200
scientists when it arrived at the

3654
02:29:40,630 --> 02:29:39,200
scientists

3655
02:29:43,429 --> 02:29:40,640
laboratory

3656
02:29:44,550 --> 02:29:43,439
it had dissolved we also had another

3657
02:29:47,670 --> 02:29:44,560
case

3658
02:29:50,630 --> 02:29:47,680
where the same thing occurred and there

3659
02:29:52,630 --> 02:29:50,640
was a state director who had this

3660
02:29:54,710 --> 02:29:52,640
implant preserved and was saying we have

3661
02:29:56,870 --> 02:29:54,720
to get this to the lab immediately

3662
02:29:58,309 --> 02:29:56,880
because it's dissolving in front of my

3663
02:30:00,550 --> 02:29:58,319
eyes

3664
02:30:02,950 --> 02:30:00,560
so you know apparently

3665
02:30:04,710 --> 02:30:02,960
they are now programmed to self

3666
02:30:06,710 --> 02:30:04,720
self-destruct

3667
02:30:09,510 --> 02:30:06,720
well i had something similar happen i

3668
02:30:11,830 --> 02:30:09,520
found some highly unusual yellowish kind

3669
02:30:14,469 --> 02:30:11,840
of orange marmalade type

3670
02:30:17,590 --> 02:30:14,479
oily substance enough to cover the you

3671
02:30:20,790 --> 02:30:17,600
know an entire quarter you know coin

3672
02:30:23,270 --> 02:30:20,800
and i videotape myself putting it into a

3673
02:30:25,429 --> 02:30:23,280
sealed film container

3674
02:30:28,389 --> 02:30:25,439
wrapping it with tape signing my name on

3675
02:30:30,469 --> 02:30:28,399
the tape having it immediately sent up

3676
02:30:32,790 --> 02:30:30,479
that day to denver to have it analyzed

3677
02:30:35,030 --> 02:30:32,800
and when they opened it up

3678
02:30:37,349 --> 02:30:35,040
not only was there nothing in there

3679
02:30:39,990 --> 02:30:37,359
extensive scientific testing of the

3680
02:30:41,270 --> 02:30:40,000
inside of the film container um came to

3681
02:30:43,429 --> 02:30:41,280
you know they came to the conclusion

3682
02:30:45,910 --> 02:30:43,439
that the only thing that had ever been

3683
02:30:48,710 --> 02:30:45,920
inside the container was film we have

3684
02:30:49,990 --> 02:30:48,720
video footage of us actually you see the

3685
02:30:52,150 --> 02:30:50,000
the material

3686
02:30:53,270 --> 02:30:52,160
being put inside the film container and

3687
02:30:55,910 --> 02:30:53,280
it left

3688
02:30:57,590 --> 02:30:55,920
zero trace scientifically that it ever

3689
02:31:00,630 --> 02:30:57,600
been there

3690
02:31:02,389 --> 02:31:00,640
so i can identify with that yes

3691
02:31:04,870 --> 02:31:02,399
i still say there's some sort of

3692
02:31:06,870 --> 02:31:04,880
tricksterism going on here folks

3693
02:31:08,870 --> 02:31:06,880
how could there not be do we have any

3694
02:31:11,750 --> 02:31:08,880
more questions before we

3695
02:31:12,870 --> 02:31:11,760
end the episode let's see i think so how

3696
02:31:16,150 --> 02:31:12,880
about the

3697
02:31:17,110 --> 02:31:16,160
the january 6 1976 stanford kentucky

3698
02:31:19,429 --> 02:31:17,120
case

3699
02:31:20,870 --> 02:31:19,439
involving mona stafford louise smith and

3700
02:31:22,870 --> 02:31:20,880
elaine thomas

3701
02:31:24,950 --> 02:31:22,880
sand who's been a

3702
02:31:26,230 --> 02:31:24,960
poster here for about 10 months is

3703
02:31:29,270 --> 02:31:26,240
wondering

3704
02:31:31,670 --> 02:31:29,280
about this case um i guess elaine thomas

3705
02:31:33,030 --> 02:31:31,680
was also involved so the three ladies he

3706
02:31:35,349 --> 02:31:33,040
says it's always appeared impressive

3707
02:31:37,190 --> 02:31:35,359
although not well known it received a

3708
02:31:39,510 --> 02:31:37,200
lot of press coverage at the time it

3709
02:31:41,030 --> 02:31:39,520
happened but not much attention in the

3710
02:31:43,830 --> 02:31:41,040
years since are you familiar with this

3711
02:31:46,870 --> 02:31:43,840
case i'm not actually yes i i found it

3712
02:31:49,110 --> 02:31:46,880
to be an intriguing case actually and

3713
02:31:51,590 --> 02:31:49,120
the three women were in touch with my

3714
02:31:54,230 --> 02:31:51,600
aunt betty hill who

3715
02:31:58,309 --> 02:31:54,240
these ladies were very shaken by what

3716
02:32:02,870 --> 02:31:58,319
occurred and i sat in my aunt's

3717
02:32:05,590 --> 02:32:02,880
home and spoke with dr james carter who

3718
02:32:07,349 --> 02:32:05,600
was the chief of investigations

3719
02:32:09,590 --> 02:32:07,359
for apro

3720
02:32:11,590 --> 02:32:09,600
at the time and he had

3721
02:32:14,550 --> 02:32:11,600
done an investigation with these three

3722
02:32:17,750 --> 02:32:14,560
women leonard stringfield old time

3723
02:32:19,270 --> 02:32:17,760
investigator was involved leo sprinkle

3724
02:32:20,870 --> 02:32:19,280
was involved

3725
02:32:23,429 --> 02:32:20,880
and

3726
02:32:24,710 --> 02:32:23,439
the the three women the story goes that

3727
02:32:26,469 --> 02:32:24,720
they

3728
02:32:30,070 --> 02:32:26,479
sort of on the spur the moment had

3729
02:32:32,150 --> 02:32:30,080
decided to drive to another town to

3730
02:32:34,630 --> 02:32:32,160
have dinner at a restaurant one of the

3731
02:32:37,349 --> 02:32:34,640
women was having a birthday

3732
02:32:40,070 --> 02:32:37,359
they sat they sketched they had dinner

3733
02:32:42,550 --> 02:32:40,080
they did not drink any alcohol and

3734
02:32:43,670 --> 02:32:42,560
they're driving back to

3735
02:32:45,670 --> 02:32:43,680
their home

3736
02:32:47,990 --> 02:32:45,680
their respective homes

3737
02:32:51,590 --> 02:32:48,000
when all of a sudden they saw what

3738
02:32:54,389 --> 02:32:51,600
looked like a plane that was about to

3739
02:32:56,950 --> 02:32:54,399
crash it looked like a an object in free

3740
02:32:58,469 --> 02:32:56,960
fall only it stopped

3741
02:33:01,030 --> 02:32:58,479
and it was

3742
02:33:02,309 --> 02:33:01,040
above their vehicle and then it

3743
02:33:05,270 --> 02:33:02,319
projected

3744
02:33:08,870 --> 02:33:05,280
a light into the car

3745
02:33:09,750 --> 02:33:08,880
and it was made it very warm inside the

3746
02:33:11,510 --> 02:33:09,760
car

3747
02:33:14,790 --> 02:33:11,520
and then

3748
02:33:17,750 --> 02:33:14,800
the car was moving very very rapidly and

3749
02:33:20,309 --> 02:33:17,760
the driver was was not able to to

3750
02:33:22,309 --> 02:33:20,319
control what was happening and then the

3751
02:33:25,110 --> 02:33:22,319
next thing it just seemed like it was

3752
02:33:27,990 --> 02:33:25,120
going backwards into a field and just

3753
02:33:31,429 --> 02:33:28,000
sort of bumping and going down a long

3754
02:33:32,950 --> 02:33:31,439
highway and under hypnosis

3755
02:33:34,389 --> 02:33:32,960
these women

3756
02:33:38,469 --> 02:33:34,399
recalled

3757
02:33:39,270 --> 02:33:38,479
having really a horrendous experience

3758
02:33:45,910 --> 02:33:39,280
where

3759
02:33:50,070 --> 02:33:48,070
there was something that tightened

3760
02:33:52,790 --> 02:33:50,080
around her and made her feel like she

3761
02:33:54,309 --> 02:33:52,800
was suffocating and it was very very

3762
02:33:57,590 --> 02:33:54,319
traumatic

3763
02:33:58,790 --> 02:33:57,600
others were the experiment was to see

3764
02:34:01,990 --> 02:33:58,800
how far

3765
02:34:04,790 --> 02:34:02,000
their limbs would move uh and it caused

3766
02:34:07,110 --> 02:34:04,800
a great deal of pain to these women it

3767
02:34:11,750 --> 02:34:07,120
was very very traumatic

3768
02:34:14,070 --> 02:34:11,760
a bit medieval yes sounds like a rack

3769
02:34:16,790 --> 02:34:14,080
yes i mean it was it was

3770
02:34:18,870 --> 02:34:16,800
terribly frightening and traumatizing

3771
02:34:19,910 --> 02:34:18,880
for these women they

3772
02:34:23,750 --> 02:34:19,920
finally

3773
02:34:26,550 --> 02:34:23,760
in real time not under hypnosis

3774
02:34:29,030 --> 02:34:26,560
found themselves uh on the road

3775
02:34:31,429 --> 02:34:29,040
approaching the town that they lived in

3776
02:34:34,150 --> 02:34:31,439
they discovered that they had lost

3777
02:34:34,950 --> 02:34:34,160
almost two hours time

3778
02:34:38,230 --> 02:34:34,960
they

3779
02:34:40,469 --> 02:34:38,240
went into the home of one of the women

3780
02:34:42,710 --> 02:34:40,479
then went to the neighbor's home to tell

3781
02:34:46,150 --> 02:34:42,720
the neighbor what had happened they they

3782
02:34:49,030 --> 02:34:46,160
sat down and individually sketched what

3783
02:34:52,389 --> 02:34:49,040
they had been what they had observed

3784
02:34:53,389 --> 02:34:52,399
and the sketches were the same

3785
02:34:56,070 --> 02:34:53,399
there were

3786
02:34:59,030 --> 02:34:56,080
physiological effects

3787
02:35:01,830 --> 02:34:59,040
conjunctivitis of the irritation

3788
02:35:05,429 --> 02:35:01,840
of the eyes

3789
02:35:06,710 --> 02:35:05,439
an electrical problem with the vehicle

3790
02:35:09,830 --> 02:35:06,720
weight loss

3791
02:35:12,389 --> 02:35:09,840
not feeling well we we saw that over and

3792
02:35:14,150 --> 02:35:12,399
over again in a lot of the earlier

3793
02:35:15,590 --> 02:35:14,160
cases

3794
02:35:18,070 --> 02:35:15,600
there was

3795
02:35:19,910 --> 02:35:18,080
redness and

3796
02:35:23,190 --> 02:35:19,920
burning on

3797
02:35:24,230 --> 02:35:23,200
the the area by the back of the neck and

3798
02:35:26,550 --> 02:35:24,240
shoulders

3799
02:35:29,750 --> 02:35:26,560
on these women and i actually

3800
02:35:31,750 --> 02:35:29,760
saw the same kind of physical effects in

3801
02:35:35,270 --> 02:35:31,760
a case that i investigated and wrote

3802
02:35:37,830 --> 02:35:35,280
about in the alien abduction files of

3803
02:35:40,950 --> 02:35:37,840
jenny henderson from new hampshire she

3804
02:35:44,230 --> 02:35:40,960
had many of these same symbol

3805
02:35:46,150 --> 02:35:44,240
are not symbols some many of these same

3806
02:35:48,550 --> 02:35:46,160
symptoms

3807
02:35:51,349 --> 02:35:48,560
the case was pretty thoroughly

3808
02:35:52,830 --> 02:35:51,359
investigated only

3809
02:35:55,630 --> 02:35:52,840
the different

3810
02:35:58,950 --> 02:35:55,640
ufo groups that were doing the

3811
02:36:01,110 --> 02:35:58,960
investigation were fighting for who is

3812
02:36:05,590 --> 02:36:01,120
going to get to control this they didn't

3813
02:36:08,710 --> 02:36:05,600
work well together yeah what else is new

3814
02:36:10,389 --> 02:36:08,720
well you know mufon tries to work with

3815
02:36:12,550 --> 02:36:10,399
other groups now

3816
02:36:15,590 --> 02:36:12,560
it's it's in our uh

3817
02:36:18,389 --> 02:36:15,600
statement online that we have respect

3818
02:36:19,910 --> 02:36:18,399
for other groups and and we try to work

3819
02:36:23,990 --> 02:36:19,920
cooperatively

3820
02:36:26,309 --> 02:36:24,000
together in fact not only am i

3821
02:36:29,270 --> 02:36:26,319
do i hold a major position in mufon i

3822
02:36:32,309 --> 02:36:29,280
also do with the foundation for research

3823
02:36:34,309 --> 02:36:32,319
interacts to extraterrestrial encounters

3824
02:36:36,389 --> 02:36:34,319
so we do try to

3825
02:36:38,710 --> 02:36:36,399
work cooperatively today

3826
02:36:42,870 --> 02:36:38,720
but it was really an obstruction to

3827
02:36:45,670 --> 02:36:42,880
investigation early on and unfortunately

3828
02:36:47,910 --> 02:36:45,680
it was the experiencers who suffered

3829
02:36:49,990 --> 02:36:47,920
from all of this in my opinion

3830
02:36:51,270 --> 02:36:50,000
we are just about to have time kathleen

3831
02:36:53,030 --> 02:36:51,280
martin would you tell our listeners

3832
02:36:55,030 --> 02:36:53,040
where they can find more about the stuff

3833
02:36:57,469 --> 02:36:55,040
that you do well you can go to my

3834
02:37:02,309 --> 02:36:57,479
website at kathleen with a

3835
02:37:07,270 --> 02:37:04,230
my upcoming speaking engagements are

3836
02:37:10,710 --> 02:37:07,280
there many articles i've written that

3837
02:37:13,510 --> 02:37:10,720
you can read at no charge also you can

3838
02:37:16,150 --> 02:37:13,520
order autographed copies of my books

3839
02:37:18,710 --> 02:37:16,160
online you can find us on twitter if you

3840
02:37:21,830 --> 02:37:18,720
look for the power cast look for the

3841
02:37:23,270 --> 02:37:21,840
power cast on twitter look for two not

3842
02:37:26,309 --> 02:37:23,280
one but two

3843
02:37:27,750 --> 02:37:26,319
power cast fan clubs on facebook and as

3844
02:37:30,070 --> 02:37:27,760
i've said before you can't get rid of

3845
02:37:32,150 --> 02:37:30,080
one without getting rid of

3846
02:37:34,389 --> 02:37:32,160
all the contents and that one can't

3847
02:37:36,870 --> 02:37:34,399
merge them that's facebook has a some

3848
02:37:38,870 --> 02:37:36,880
weird stuff going on there we also have

3849
02:37:41,270 --> 02:37:38,880
a second radio show we'd love you to

3850
02:37:43,429 --> 02:37:41,280
listen to we'd love you to discover

3851
02:37:45,750 --> 02:37:43,439
after the power casts an exclusive

3852
02:37:47,830 --> 02:37:45,760
feature of the power cast plus go to

3853
02:37:51,670 --> 02:37:47,840
plus.powercast.com

3854
02:37:53,830 --> 02:37:51,680
p l u s dot thepowercast.com

3855
02:37:54,630 --> 02:37:53,840
we also offer the ad free version of the

3856
02:37:57,030 --> 02:37:54,640
show

3857
02:37:58,309 --> 02:37:57,040
free of 41 minutes of network ads so

3858
02:37:59,190 --> 02:37:58,319
it's shorter

3859
02:38:01,270 --> 02:37:59,200
and

3860
02:38:02,389 --> 02:38:01,280
it's all available if you subscribe for

3861
02:38:05,429 --> 02:38:02,399
a low

3862
02:38:08,710 --> 02:38:05,439
monthly annual five-year and now

3863
02:38:11,270 --> 02:38:08,720
lifetime membership we also offer free

3864
02:38:13,030 --> 02:38:11,280
ebooks for long-term subscriptions we

3865
02:38:15,510 --> 02:38:13,040
just started adding

3866
02:38:17,190 --> 02:38:15,520
transcripts for two of the most popular

3867
02:38:19,510 --> 02:38:17,200
shows we've ever broadcast on the

3868
02:38:22,150 --> 02:38:19,520
powercast video coming

3869
02:38:23,750 --> 02:38:22,160
video is coming any day now chris is

3870
02:38:26,710 --> 02:38:23,760
putting final touches on the first

3871
02:38:28,830 --> 02:38:26,720
sampler there will be more

3872
02:38:30,950 --> 02:38:28,840
find out what's going on plus

3873
02:38:34,790 --> 02:38:30,960
drpowercast.com that's p

3874
02:38:36,389 --> 02:38:34,800
l u s dot the powercast.com

3875
02:38:38,389 --> 02:38:36,399
so please check it out

3876
02:38:40,230 --> 02:38:38,399
kathleen martin thank you for setting us

3877
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straight on what's going on

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with ufo abductions thank you for

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joining us on the powercast thanks for

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the powercast featuring gene steinberg

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and christopher o'brien is a copyrighted

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presentation of making the impossible

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incorporated